5.Maegan Rees — Direct (Part 2)
1,590 linesMS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, before the break, you had discussed certain excerpts of messages referencing Camilla's residence at the time. So now I am going to skip to the next slide, which is page 221 of Government Exhibit 301-R, and starting at the top, on November 23, 2014, at 11:33 a.m., Keith Raniere, if you can fix these things now, you must leave there immediately and not come back. Answer please, anything else?
MAEGAN REES: Not really, just staffing stuff.
MS. HAJJAR: How are you going to reverse this and the perception of everyone there?
MAEGAN REES: I don't know.
MS. HAJJAR: Then leave now. I can't cover for you?
MAEGAN REES: It was frightening that you are commanding that.
MS. HAJJAR: Question mark. It's frightening what you did again. I can't believe you just wrote that.
MAEGAN REES: I feel at your mercy.
MS. HAJJAR: You either fix, leave or we're done. That's awful. I've been at your mercy and you abused the power. I want to know you understand your abuse.
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: Question mark. Then fix, leave or we're done. Which?
MAEGAN REES: I'll fix.
MS. HAJJAR: How?
MAEGAN REES: I'll treat him like a rapist.
MS. HAJJAR: That's what you should have done. You already told the rapist that you can't be taken seriously. What more care are you going to do to get back what you lost?
MAEGAN REES: I don't know.
MS. HAJJAR: You need to go to him, tell him you tried to be friendly but can't stomach it and that he should please stay away without him thinking you're infatuated. He needs to know you're disgusted, like you would a rapist?
MAEGAN REES: I'll try.
MS. HAJJAR: Not good enough. Leave now.
MAEGAN REES: No. I'll do it.
MS. HAJJAR: This is more serious than you know. How can you allow these things? Say something. When did the sitting thing happen?
MAEGAN REES: I want to feel free. I feel my entire person depends on you. It is very scary and suffocating. I can't remember.
MS. HAJJAR: Then turning to page 222 of Government Exhibit 301-R, I am going to start at 12:03 p.m. on November 23, 2014, Keith Raniere: Call me now ? That's last chance. Move your stuff out tonight.
MAEGAN REES: I wish you didn't make me into a monster.
MS. HAJJAR: You are treating me that way. Anything else to say? I'm going over to start moving some things out. Nothing else? I will block you in one minute and then I can't reverse it. Your pride won.
I guess I still can't believe you're really uncaring when I'm the one who's damaged. I want you moved out by tomorrow morning. Then there's a few things that need to be done.
I am going to turn to the next page, page 233 of Government Exhibit 301-R, if you could start with the highlighted portion on November 24th.
MAEGAN REES: 8:13 p.m. I feel like your puppet.
MS. HAJJAR: I will reassess all of these interactions. He will. As for you, that doesn't help me. If you feel like my puppet, I don't know what to say. You should know me better. I won't work that way. What I'm asking you to do is rightful. How you're treating me is also important. Please respect my morality.
MAEGAN REES: You're asking me to do something I'm not comfortable blindly.
MS. HAJJAR: How can I unblind you? To fix other things you will have to do things absolutely blindly. This is simple and rightful. Honestly, if I haven't even earned this level of trust, we are nothing with no hope. You should want to prove yourself. At this point I should never have to argue a request. The harder the request, the better. You wanted to be my slave. This is the opposite. But I have earned the trust.
(Continued on following page.)
EXAMINATION CONTINUES BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Now, Agent Rees, in the messages you reviewed, are there instances in which Camila asked permission of the defendant to do certain things?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you give some examples of that to the jury?
MAEGAN REES: Camila would ask permission to text anyone. She asked permission to cut her hair. Among a few other things.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to the next slide, which is slide 57.
Are these some excerpts of the exhibits you've reviewed in which Camila asked for permission for various things?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, that's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Starting from the top. Can you please read the highlighted portions?
MAEGAN REES: October 24th, 2014, 4:49 p.m.: Love, I really hate that I feel like I have to ask you for permission to do anything outside of my schedule. I don't want us to be like this.
May 11th, 2015: 11:44 a.m.: Can I text my family?
MS. HAJJAR: Yes.
MAEGAN REES: June 12th, 2015, 10:48 p.m.: Oh, which reminds me, can I ask your permission for something? Can I shave the kitty? I'd save whatever I take off for you.
August 12th, 2015, 8:25 p.m.: Can I get your opinion/permission on something?
Four days away for a Flamenco workshop.
MS. HAJJAR: Give me a day, likely a yes.
MAEGAN REES: Okay, I won't consider it a yes yet. Thank you for considering.
MS. HAJJAR: And, Agent Rees, in some of the messages you reviewed, does Camila express sadness and depression?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, she does.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to the next slide, which is excerpts of certain messages, can you start from the top starting on December 8th, 2014, 11:38 p.m.?
MAEGAN REES: You have taken all my life.
MS. HAJJAR: Please tell me how. Really, what do you mean so I can understand?
MAEGAN REES: You have taken everything that is important and meaningful to me. But it is more than that, you have branded me for life. Your words have destroyed me. I feel helpless and worthless. I feel dead inside.
December 24th, 2014, 10:49 p.m.: I don't know how to handle your actions. I considered ending my life again. I don't think you realize how your words and actions affect me.
December 27th, 2015, 6:02 p.m.: I feel depressed. The only concern I can see that would be legitimate would be that I am going crazy and that I'm not emotionally sound. I have not cut my hair. I was going to cut it the day after you left. I don't feel like going out and seeing people. I feel very low.
MS. HAJJAR: Now turning back to Government Exhibit 301-R on page 239. Just starting from the top at the highlighted portion, can you read Camila's portion?
MAEGAN REES: November 27th, 2014, 1:24 a.m.: Okay, I'll change. What do you want me to do?
MS. HAJJAR: Trust me 100 percent. Obey me 100 percent. I will come up with an immediate test. Any failure is unacceptable. You have to earn me. No out of causedness.
MAEGAN REES: Okay.
MS. HAJJAR: Now, I need a vow of absolute obedience, which I will not release you from until the letter next summer. Now more uncertainty -- no more uncertainty, doubts or not trusting. I need to know what happens if you fail or act unhappy?
I expect you to text me this vow now. I will text you later. I expect you to answer right away, otherwise no go. You need to be happy, whenever you are with me, because my time means that much. Yes?
MAEGAN REES: Reading. Just got a whole bunch of your texts.
MS. HAJJAR: I need a yes or no now.
MAEGAN REES: Emoticon.
MS. HAJJAR: That's a no. Please pack up then.
MAEGAN REES: I can't do it, love. I'd be wasting your time. Please don't be mad.
MS. HAJJAR: Right, pack up.
MAEGAN REES: Please don't hate me.
MS. HAJJAR: I'll contact you tomorrow, please move out.
Then turning to the next page, page 240 starting at the top, November 27th, 2014, 1:45 a.m.
Keith Raniere: No compromise. I have compromised too long and you have abused it. A stranger should have been treated better.
MAEGAN REES: What am I supposed to do? I'm sorry.
MS. HAJJAR: Bullshit. Either take the vow and do what you know is right and love me or stop using the situation and move out. Simple.
MAEGAN REES: You seemed so nice earlier today. What happened? You're being so heartless. What happened to your offer from last night?
MS. HAJJAR: No, you are heartless. I am just making a firm demand for once. If I were heartless, I would just kick you out. I am demanding what I deserve. There is nothing heartless about it. What is heartless is your behavior and how you treat me. Heartless is never even committing to fix what you did.
You abused last night's offer. No more discussion or selling. You change dramatically or leave. This is the last time I'm calling. Your phone rolled to voicemail. It's up to you.
MAEGAN REES: My phone died in the middle of the text. Why are you being so cruel? Please don't.
MS. HAJJAR: That's insulting.
MAEGAN REES: I have no one to go to. Please don't be like this. I'll do whatever you want. Please don't be like this.
MS. HAJJAR: Have I earned whatever I'm demanding? If so, it's not cruel to demand it absolutely. If not, just leave. There is no cruelty. You -- through give me uncertainty when I have earned so much moreover nine years, nine years, plus the things you've done are cruel. Calling me cruel in light of that is cruel. You haven't even fixed and you use your uncertainty to take.
Text me your vow. Prove to me you know I'm not being cruel at all. I'll give you a test later or else leave. It's simple.
MAEGAN REES: I closed off the rest of my world for you. I don't have friends because of you. I have no one to go to because of you. You can't abandon me like this. I didn't think you were capable of this.
MS. HAJJAR: That's a bullshit strategy. You would have betrayed me. You're having a party tomorrow. Show me you know you're being manipulative in a bad way or just leave.
MAEGAN REES: I don't know what to make of all this.
MS. HAJJAR: Your blame is revealing.
MAEGAN REES: I don't understand how you could have the heart to do this. The you that I knew would never do this. What happened?
MS. HAJJAR: This is my last text. I don't deserve blame. I need a convincing apology, a proof you understand, and a vow. These techniques you're using worked in the past. I just can't give into them anymore. If I don't get what I want, I want you out. I will not text unless I get it. Please stop the you-I-knew stuff, that's really bad. You damaged me. Cut the victim stuff. I deserve this stuff and much more. You are making things worse with your strategies and I am beginning to feel very played.
MAEGAN REES: I will go peacefully. I will need a few days to deep clean the apartment. I have never felt such deep pain. I would have never thought that you would do this. I think it's your right to kick me out or set boundaries, but you don't.
MS. HAJJAR: Then turning to -- I am going to skip to page 245, starting at the top of the highlighted portion, November 27th, 2014, 1:54 p.m.
Keith Raniere: The vow doesn't have to be that long.
MAEGAN REES: I get fearful because I project you will abuse that power.
MS. HAJJAR: There will be times it will seem like I am. I won't, but it is part of proving trust. If it never seemed questionable, then it wouldn't be trust. I've earned trust. Do it now, please.
MAEGAN REES: Okay.
MS. HAJJAR: Text it now.
MAEGAN REES: I vow to do as you say.
MS. HAJJAR: A hundred percent obedience?
MAEGAN REES: A hundred percent obedience. I don't know why I'm scared shitless.
MS. HAJJAR: You're scared because you're serious, that's good. Okay. Today you must be more or as much adult than everyone. You must be the model of restraint. No alcohol of any sort. Not a sip. And eat very little. You must build yourself to be a new woman, one that is serious about her future. This is particularly important for Fluffy. Copy? You also need to be responsive to me at all times, including now.
MAEGAN REES: Shit. Well, I'm already questioning because I don't understand why I have to do that since I don't want to be that type of woman; never have.
MS. HAJJAR: Do you want honor, dignity, respect or love? I could have said: Prove I am most important. Drop everything. Stay home today, clean and certainly don't go to Wilton. It's an insult. So I am being mild. What I said serves many purposes. You actually do want to be that type of woman. You react to terms such as slut or whore. As you age you will be seen more and more like that if you don't change.
That is true even if you're married or delegate celibate. Seen. Copy? I don't want to keep calling you to get you to answer. Please check hour WhatsApp frequently like I do for you.
I am going to turn to page 262 of Government Exhibit 301-R. Can you read the top, please?
MAEGAN REES: December 1st, 2014, 5:50 p.m.: I thought a lot about you and about us today.
MS. HAJJAR: And?
MAEGAN REES: Part of me feels like I don't want to be with you. Part of me wants to stay.
MS. HAJJAR: Then turning to the next page, page 263, this is the continuation of the line you just read. Just continue.
MAEGAN REES: Part of me wants to stay with you because I know it is right. All of me loves you. But I realize why I feel certain ways about you. I feel you as a parent, as a god. That's why your comments hurt so much. I take them as truth. You are the holder of truth. And also why part of me won't admit I did something bad because the gods are indestructible.
With a lot of our dynamics this feels very present, and although logically I know that you are not my parent, a big part of me feels the need to break away from the dependence, to be independent. I never wanted you to be my parent, but I feel sometimes we fall into that dynamic.
MS. HAJJAR: I understand. In this specific case you should want to give your god everything, certainly more than you would have ever have given R. Your belief of unsafety and intimacy with me is the real problem, especially if I were to come over and rest with you. The larger picture things you mentioned we can speak about, but it is necessary you start needing to serve me, please me, earn me, to make anything right.
MAEGAN REES: It seems like that only makes the dependency stronger. That feels super fearful.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay, I am going to skip to the next page here, slide 65. This is page 269 of Government Exhibit 301-R.
Can you read from the top, please?
MAEGAN REES: December 4th, 2014, 2:26 p.m.: Your words still haunt me. I desperately want you to know you're not correct, that you were not wrong about us, but I just fucked it up big time. One of the things you said was that I didn't want to have -- I didn't want you to have children. It was very painful to hear you say that, so I've been thinking about what to do about that.
I'm sorry that I ever led you to believe that was true. If that is what you think of me, then maybe my sister is the best person to have children with. You are not a prize I am competing for, you are my love.
MS. HAJJAR: Think of what -- think what of you, honey?
MAEGAN REES: That I don't want you to have children.
MS. HAJJAR: You wouldn't discuss or help me with the alternatives: You, your sister, other or none. You haven't done what it takes for you. I've cut off other option goes and although you won't do what it takes for you, your sister is intolerable. This is what you presented about the subject. I don't want to think that, but I see no alternative.
Agent Rees, here where Camila and the defendant are discussing Camila's sister, are there references to Camila's sister throughout the WhatsApp messages you reviewed?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there are.
MS. HAJJAR: So the next slide, slide 66, does this have an excerpt of a few of those messages referencing Camila's sister?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Starting at the October 14th, 2014 at 1:25 p.m.
Keith Raniere: My dearest love, please hear me when I say the emotions you had tonight are the core of what needs to do go. I've always believed you were stronger than your mother and your sisters (also male side, but it is pride in more of a male way.)
Can you read the next excerpt please?
MAEGAN REES: December 2nd, 2014, 12:57 p.m.: Were you serious about having children with my sister or were you using that to scare me?
December 2nd, 2014, 1:03 p.m.: You know how much we went through because of your relationship with her. I always felt that you chose her over me. If you have children with her, you'd be making the ultimate statement that that was true.
MS. HAJJAR: Then on October 11th, 2015, 5:24 p.m.
Keith Raniere: Make sure your sister doesn't see you texting.
MAEGAN REES: October 27th, 2015, 1:42 a.m.: I did. I may have not heard you because I was afraid. I really thought I was not going to be part of your life because I was so afraid that it looked like you were going to choose my sister.
MS. HAJJAR: The next slide is page 280 of Government Exhibit 301-R. December 7th, 2014, 11:09 p.m.
Keith Raniere: The apartment --
THE COURT: You might try to reboot it.
(Pause.)
THE COURT: Just give it a minute.
(Pause.)
THE COURT: Go ahead.
MS. HAJJAR: Thank you, Your Honor.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: 11:09 p.m.
Keith Raniere: The apartment will need to be done first thing tomorrow 8:00 a.m. Put all my things, money, et cetera, together. You need to increase your hours back to normal.
MAEGAN REES: I can't do that. I moved it so they were not depending on me. I will be out of work. Does that mean that I'm not doing the education thing? Can I -- can I have longer for the apartment? There are a few things I can't do because of noise and neighbors.
MS. HAJJAR: Then at 12:23 a.m.: Please say something or we just go forward with this dissolution of us. I'm surprised that you haven't written. I'm writing to say I'm very sorry for the whole situation and our interaction. I feel powerless. It's up to you.
MAEGAN REES: I've been thinking. I want to be a model for my kids, especially G. I can't lose G. I'll do what it takes. Please don't take him away from me. I'll do whatever you want.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, are there many references to G in these messages you reviewed?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there are.
MS. HAJJAR: And in context, who does G refer to?
MAEGAN REES: Gaelyn.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: Then do what it takes. That involves being at cause, fixing what are now many misperceptions, eliminating pride, and treating me as I deserve and what should have been. No anger allowed starting today -- starting now. I need to see what I feel are substantial things today.
MAEGAN REES: Okay. You won't take him away from me?
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to the next page, which is page 281. The same exhibit at the top. Can you start at December 8th, 2014, 1:17 p.m.?
MAEGAN REES: That's bullshit. You control it all. You decide. I'll do what you want. I don't think what you're doing is right. You're abusing your power, but I am powerless and I want my kid. I was more there for him than you ever were. I don't know how you can be okay with yourself doing this.
MS. HAJJAR: Great start. I don't think this is gonna work.
MAEGAN REES: I already told you I would do what you want.
MS. HAJJAR: You have to change your behavior and values to be a model. Here's one assignment to be done now. Prove to me what you said above was both mean and incorrect. It seems you have no concept of why you do the things you do, why you feel the way you do, or why I do the things I do. If you understood these things you would be so sad about what you have done and are doing. You would be sad at what I'm facing and you would be sorry for the way you treat me, the things you think, and what you've said.
You still don't get it?
MAEGAN REES: I feel like a prisoner. This is your world and your rules. If you suddenly decide to change the rules, which you have, it is fine because this is your kingdom. I can either abide by your ruling or leave. Unfortunately, I promised I wouldn't, so I am in your kingdom under your rules. It doesn't mean I agree. I had always believed you would never hold me like this, that you would let me go as you would say. You forgot to mention that would unleash your fury if I ever wanted to go, so I am all yours. What do you want me to do?
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to the next page, which is page 321 of Government Exhibit 301-R. Starting at the top, December 24th, 2014, 8:04 p.m.
Keith Raniere: That response is like a monster. I have not called you a monster yet. I've spent six months painting to prove you're not. You are quite insulting and take everything I've done for granted. This whole time you have not fixed, but are playing victim. If you're not a monster, shouldn't I act as I am? Or if you are a monster, shouldn't I act as I am? Isn't my moral duty to those who depend on me?
Prove you are not a monster, that is what's needed. Stop accusing me falsely of calling you one. You've done monstrous actions. Prove you are not a monster. It is only right. You've done monstrous actions. It is morally right you prove you're not a monster. That means you're not a victim. Not going to blame. Not going to feel sorry for yourself. Not going to distract.
Please say something compassionate, caring and not monstrous. I have tried calling you to speak. You seem to be avoiding. Just look at this from my side, you are seeming like a monster using monster strategies. Make your decision explicitly in cause without distraction or any strategies, please.
MAEGAN REES: You want me to enjoy being abused. It's not going to happen. I am aware of the conditions. My life is yours. That is my decision. I hope to one day understand your actions.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, in this exchange on December 4th, 2014, are there many references to the word monster back and forth?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there are.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to the next slide, which is excerpts from -- this is Christmas Eve 2014 starting from the top.
Can you read the portion from Camila?
MAEGAN REES: 7:30 p.m.: Wow, I am not the heartless monster you are making me out to be.
MS. HAJJAR: Please move out. Do not come to volleyball. Do not come to Nancy's tonight.
MAEGAN REES: I am not the monster you are making me out to be. You have it all wrong.
MS. HAJJAR: Prove it. A monster would say that also for their gain. Taking a long time is what monsters do. Please stop. I've dealt with many monsters.
MAEGAN REES: Do you really think I'm a monster?
MS. HAJJAR: Please don't do this. This is truly a monster response, prideful and evasive. You just said you made one. Tell me your decision , please. I tried calling you to speak. You seem to be avoiding. Just look at this from my side. You're seeming like a monster using monster strategies.
Turning to slide 71.
Agent Rees, in some of the messages you reviewed are there references to this Christmas Eve?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. Can you read these excerpts starting on October 22nd, 2015?
MAEGAN REES: 1:45 p.m.: Oh, I also have something else to tell you. I may have told you already, but I just want to be sure.
MS. HAJJAR: What?
MAEGAN REES: I told you that I called and hung up on a domestic abuse hotline on or around Christmas Eve. I remember you had forbidden me from going to Nancy's party. I don't know if it was before or after that, but I created an account on this site that I am telling you about, that's how I know of it. And tried connecting with people with the same problem. That's what the site is for. You find people going through the same thing or support people going through hard situations. It's anonymous and I never did connect with anyone.
December 24th, 2015, 1:58 a.m.: You forbid me from going to Nancy's and I stayed home an felt helpless like a victim, and that's the night I called the hotline.
MS. HAJJAR: All right, I am turning to Government Exhibit 301-R page 327.
Agent Rees, you talked earlier about the references to successor before. I am going to start from December 27th, 2014, 10:44 p.m.
Keith Raniere: No. You have to find someone, somebody else for us.
MAEGAN REES: I know of a 26-year old virgin, but you won't like her.
MS. HAJJAR: Maybe not. Why?
MAEGAN REES: You only like the pretty ones.
MS. HAJJAR: Not only, but for the purpose of successor the virginity has to be for certain reasons.
MAEGAN REES: Question mark.
MS. HAJJAR: Was she the exo-eso virgin?
MAEGAN REES: Oh, which one is that? Sorry, which is that one?
MS. HAJJAR: Who is she?
MAEGAN REES: You first.
MS. HAJJAR: Lola's gay cousin?
MAEGAN REES: Question mark -- oh.
MS. HAJJAR: And yours?
MAEGAN REES: I didn't know she had a gay cousin. Name? Is she cute.
MS. HAJJAR: I can get it. No, not cute, plain.
Then turning to the next page, page 328 of the same exhibit. December 27th, 2014, 10:58 p.m.
Keith Raniere: Okay. Get the R situation right. Find other virgin. A third slave doesn't have to be a virgin.
MAEGAN REES: Third?
MS. HAJJAR: A slave would be a third person. I wouldn't want it without you.
Then turning to page 332 of the same exhibit. December 30th, 2014, 2:59 p.m.
Keith Raniere: Does Ana know suitable virgins? You will create trouble with your beauty and your smile.
MAEGAN REES: Nah.
MS. HAJJAR: Yes. Few rational men or women can resist you. Was nah for that or the virgin question?
MAEGAN REES: That. I don't know about the virgin question.
MS. HAJJAR: I would so much like to spend time with you.
Agent Rees, I just want to note, the times here, it says 3 o'clock a.m., the messages you reviewed, you said you reviewed thousands of them.
Can you describe the times of day and the frequency of the messages?
MAEGAN REES: Yes. This would be representative of the time of day where the bulk of the conversations would occur, either late at night or in the very early morning hours.
MS. HAJJAR: And the messages, how frequent were the message exchanges?
MAEGAN REES: Seconds or minutes apart.
MS. HAJJAR: What length of time are we talking about?
MAEGAN REES: Of the messages that I reviewed?
MS. HAJJAR: Yes.
MAEGAN REES: I reviewed messages from August of 2014 through December of 2015.
MS. HAJJAR: And in terms of frequency of the messages you reviewed?
MAEGAN REES: Hundreds of messages a day.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, is the -- are there references in the WhatsApp messages you reviewed to Camila having a child with the defendant?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: So I am going to turn to page 358 of the same exhibit, and we'll read from the top starting at January 8th, 2:22 a.m.
Keith Raniere: Just that. If you want my baby, I want you to say it explicitly.
MAEGAN REES: I understand. I would -- will.
MS. HAJJAR: If you feel that way this moment, it would be good to say it.
MAEGAN REES: I understand.
MS. HAJJAR: I thought you did at this moment. I'm sorry.
MAEGAN REES: Emoticon.
MS. HAJJAR: This could have been big for us. Goodnight.
MAEGAN REES: What do you mean?
MS. HAJJAR: No more to be said. You needed to be strong and true.
MAEGAN REES: I feel bad. What did I do? Did I say something wrong? What just happened?
MS. HAJJAR: Deep inside you should absolutely want my baby. If not, there is something I can't talk about.
MAEGAN REES: Oh. Emoticon.
MS. HAJJAR: If you either don't know that, think differently, or don't have the conscience to say it, you are not where I had hoped. Which is it?
MAEGAN REES: I'm close, love.
MS. HAJJAR: Which is it?
MAEGAN REES: I'm not understanding. I'm missing something important here. I either don't know what. Think differently about what?
MS. HAJJAR: Wanting my baby enough now to text it.
MAEGAN REES: I do want it.
MS. HAJJAR: Then text it explicitly. I don't understand why you avoided that.
MAEGAN REES: Because it is not that simple.
MS. HAJJAR: Actually, it is and by rights should be. It's that you think it's not that scares me about conscience.
MAEGAN REES: Don't. I do want your baby.
MS. HAJJAR: Then all you needed to do was text that in the first place. Why didn't you?
MAEGAN REES: I don't know.
MS. HAJJAR: That's what really scares me. You need to know why, apologize for not, because that's what you want and never fall victim to that process again. You insult our baby by not.
MAEGAN REES: I understand. I think of the circumstances that that baby would be brought into and that is why I am hesitant.
MS. HAJJAR: You need to be more causative. You caused these circumstances. You need to uncause them.
MAEGAN REES: I understand.
MS. HAJJAR: So do from now on and text things like: I want your baby! And mean them because it will help you cause it instead of waiting.
MAEGAN REES: Okay.
MS. HAJJAR: Starting now.
MAEGAN REES: Okay. I want your baby.
(Continuing on the following page.)
(Continuing)
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to what's in evidence at Government Exhibit 302-R.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: Can you describe this cover e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: This e-mail is from Cami to Camila@yahoo.com dated March 4th, 2015, with the subject WhatsApp chat with Unknown Caller.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to the second page of this exhibit.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: Starting on January 11th, 9:46 p.m.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: Still I have to ask again. R schedule? Is it that you don't respect my questions?
MAEGAN REES: Tomorrow I busy, 8 to 12:00. What about R? I guess I don't get your question.
MS. HAJJAR: Interactions. Any?
MAEGAN REES: No.
MS. HAJJAR: I wish you said things like no, honey. I love you. I wish you cared enough. So whenever there was a chance you might run into him, you would eagerly tell me and report everything that happened without my having to ask. That would be more loving and caring about the situation and me.
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: Yes, honey, I love you and we'll make it right. That would have given me more hope.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, when Keith Raniere says: Schedule, question mark, and Camila responds: Tomorrow, I'm busy 8 to 12. Is that a common exchange you saw in these messages?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, that's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you explain that a little bit to the jury?
MAEGAN REES: Keith Raniere would consistently ask Camila to provide him her schedule and often she would provide it. And then he would ask repeatedly over for her to continue to provide the same schedule.
MS. HAJJAR: And these were like daily schedules: Tomorrow, I'm busy 8 to 12?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Were they sometimes more specific with details about what Camila was to do every day?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, that's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. I'm turning to page 8 of the same exhibit.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: This is January 14th, 2:18 a.m.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: Probably not a virgin but okay as a slave?
MAEGAN REES: I think she's hot but not appealing. Huh. Do you still want to sleep?
MS. HAJJAR: Yeah, I don't find her appealing but interesting as a slave. Only if you do.
MAEGAN REES: I can go for a slave, really?
MS. HAJJAR: What do you mean? Of course.
MAEGAN REES: Any preferences in looks? What do you want in a slave?
MS. HAJJAR: Ideally what would you want? What would you like?
MAEGAN REES: I like them younger than me, but don't mind if she's older, brunette or blonde, not talk or not to talk, innocent looking, hee hee hee.
MS. HAJJAR: Virgin?
MAEGAN REES: For me? No. For you, yes.
Oh, that was tall, not talk.
MS. HAJJAR: Can have more than one. But if you found a successor, we could be together forever.
MAEGAN REES: Okay.
MS. HAJJAR: I like shorter than me. Younger than you is fine. Just so they have character which they would have to prove through obedience.
MAEGAN REES: Got it.
MS. HAJJAR: And?
MAEGAN REES: Hmm. Do you mean obedience as in slave-type obedience?
MS. HAJJAR: Yes, but in other ways, too. Obedience is good, don't you think? Wink. Wink.
MAEGAN REES: Not in a slave-type. I'm not into that. But yes. I don't like the whole dominatrix thing.
MS. HAJJAR: Yes, but if you now obeyed me absolutely, we would be better off. Obedience for her in the form of tests of loyalty. Wink. Wink.
MAEGAN REES: That's why I said but yes, I am agreeing with you FYI.
MS. HAJJAR: So when will you locate a first candidate we can consider?
MAEGAN REES: In the next few days. I'll look locally but not within the community, unless you want me to.
MS. HAJJAR: I agree. It would have to be a rare circumstance to find someone within this community. How will you look outside?
MAEGAN REES: I don't know yet. We'll figure it out.
MS. HAJJAR: You might be able to get some help unbeknownst to the giver of the help by people in the community. Some of them would bring you to people in Mexico though so more difficult.
MAEGAN REES: Question mark. In Mexico? Why Mexico?
MS. HAJJAR: Some of the women who might aid you are from there or Texas.
MAEGAN REES: I'm not following. I am so sorry. Are we still talking about a girl?
MS. HAJJAR: Yes.
MAEGAN REES: Okay.
MS. HAJJAR: And this continuation of the next page.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: Some of our community members have noncommunity friends of the proper age, et cetera. Mostly in Mexico, I think?
MAEGAN REES: I'm going to try to sleep again. Okay. Gotcha.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: And then at 6:10 p.m.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: I wish you would write. I've gone back and forth to several women in the intensive on quite extensive matters and I have not gotten a word from you. Am I really that unimportant?
MAEGAN REES: No, love. I have a shitty phone. I can only charge a little bit at a time. It has been intense emotionally. I'm a little overwhelmed. How are you? Do you miss me? I have been thinking of getting a girl.
MS. HAJJAR: Why didn't you text during lunch?
MAEGAN REES: I am staff but honestly I've been a little out of it. I feel overwhelmed.
MS. HAJJAR: Why?
MAEGAN REES: I am sorry, love. Because of the first intake sheet. Your choice of questions.
MS. HAJJAR: Why did that affect you negatively?
MAEGAN REES: Media omitted. A little bit.
MS. HAJJAR: Is she available?
MAEGAN REES: I can find out.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, the media omitted. You testified earlier that when you exported chats from your phone, there was a notation image omitted.
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Is that an option in WhatsApp to omit media when exporting chats?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: So 8:00 p.m.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Is she available?
MAEGAN REES: I can find out.
MS. HAJJAR: Fits the profile, do you?
MAEGAN REES: She might be. Then I have to ask it she minds my older boyfriend.
MS. HAJJAR: One step at a time.
MAEGAN REES: Media omitted. Media omitted.
MS. HAJJAR: The first is the best for me. She also looks energetically best. Why upset by the question on the intake form? What part upsets you? What are their names? My assumption is they are not ESPians, Tindr-derived or the like.
MAEGAN REES: Right, not ESPians.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to the following page at 4:12 a.m. January 15th.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Defendant writes: By the way, I am -- I suspect I'm a pretty sellable guy beyond being just an older boyfriend. Maybe in more marketing sensitive approach may be useful.
MS. HAJJAR: And then I'm going to skip to page 31. January 25th, 2:00 p.m.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: Why did it plummet?
MAEGAN REES: My fear and out-of-causeness.
MS. HAJJAR: Fear and out-of-causeness about what specifically? Why would that make it drop?
MAEGAN REES: I felt unsafe and that fed into not wanting to. So then I felt more unsafe and then, et cetera.
MS. HAJJAR: When did this start?
MAEGAN REES: Thanksgiving.
MS. HAJJAR: Why then?
MAEGAN REES: The first time I felt conditioned by you.
MS. HAJJAR: Conditioned how?
MAEGAN REES: Like I wanted to leave. I felt blackmailed. Emphasis on felt.
MS. HAJJAR: Turn to page 34 of the same exhibit, January 27th, 9:27 p.m.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Do I disgust you physically?
MAEGAN REES: No, my lovey. You are delicious.
MS. HAJJAR: Oh, what did the emoticon mean?
MAEGAN REES: It was too abrupt but I am not disgusted by you.
MS. HAJJAR: Ideally nothing could ever be too abrupt between authentic lovers. Otherwise, it can never be safe or genuine. I wish you could figure out how I could ever be too abrupt for you. Maybe that reaction can trace to something truthful, an area of pride perhaps.
You can never be too abrupt with me unless you act out of fear and not love. I guess in thinking about it, I am very sad. Anything could be too abrupt.
MAEGAN REES: It feels violent. It feels like I am a thing and that scares me. I will look at it more.
MS. HAJJAR: So agent Rees, have you also reviewed photographs that were provided by Google in response to a search warrant for the vicibaby@gmail.com account?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, I have.
MS. HAJJAR: And is it fair to say that some of these photographs are nude photographs of Camila?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, they are.
MS. HAJJAR: Graphically nude photographs of Camila?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to page 43 of Government's Exhibit 302.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: I'm going to start reading from February 1st, 7:46 p.m.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: The picture, do I get your face in it too, an imitation?
MAEGAN REES: Yes. When I look better. Right now I am super-puffy and unattractive.
MS. HAJJAR: But it's for me. Make me the very best one you can and one you would never send to anyone else ever.
MAEGAN REES: I look yucky, hon. Can I send you one tomorrow?
MS. HAJJAR: Then make it a special pussy shot. Invite me like you would invite nobody else. Yes on tomorrow also.
MAEGAN REES: Okay. I will make it a special one.
MS. HAJJAR: Make yourself look your greatest.
MAEGAN REES: Will do, honey.
MS. HAJJAR: Waiting with great expectations.
MAEGAN REES: Oh, boy, no pressure.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. Switching to the next page, page 44 at the top.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read the highlighted portion starting at 7:55 p.m.?
MAEGAN REES: Oh, I'll show you. Are you still with R?
MS. HAJJAR: Now, not with R anymore. At airport. Show me now.
MAEGAN REES: Still no face but see how she's open saying feed me. Are you by yourself?
MS. HAJJAR: Sort of. Nancy is near and in public waiting at gate.
MAEGAN REES: Guard these pics, okay?
MS. HAJJAR: Yes, of course. You have copies? You know I guard the other pictures, right?
MAEGAN REES: I have copies. And original.
MS. HAJJAR: They're off my phone. You know I have the others, yes?
MAEGAN REES: From way back when?
MS. HAJJAR: I wanted the original forever. I thought it was truly mine. Yes, from way back.
MAEGAN REES: Oh, my honey, I am so sorry.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you get me another and will you give me what is left forever?
MAEGAN REES: Phone froze. Give me a sec. Not working.
MS. HAJJAR: All right. I'm going to skip to the page 56 of Government's Exhibit 302-R at 2:24 p.m.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: Our future --
MS. HAJJAR: Actually, the line just before that.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Camila says: I didn't say I was going to write a letter to Jim, I want to talk to him?
Keith Raniere: Our future. If you don't convince me, I will leave. As of right now, I will get over the next months exactly what I got over the last months. After my waiting for you, hurting myself to keep some door open, you repay me with more betrayal and dishonesty on top. I don't want this anymore. I'm giving you a chance to change and prove it.
Talking to him is probably the inferior option. You have to tape it. Rehearse it. Guarantee exactly what you will say and how you will say it and say no more.
I don't trust you. A letter is more trustworthy.
MAEGAN REES: A letter is cold.
MS. HAJJAR: Look what happened when I trusted you to end things with R in one day. Yes, a letter is colder, but considering what you did, you need to be cold. You have already damaged everything with him and Esther.
MAEGAN REES: What? How?
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, the discussion of a letter to Jim, is this a frequent subject of conversation in these WhatsApp messages?
MAEGAN REES: That is correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. And turning to page 64 of the same exhibit.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: I'm going to start from 10:03 p.m., February 5th, that's a few lines down.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: What is the absolute deadline then?? Why are you so unresponsive? What happened again to you?
MAEGAN REES: Hmm, I've been next to my phone. I did not hear your messages drop. I am so sorry.
MS. HAJJAR: Deadline? Deadline?
MAEGAN REES: I don't know. I wanted to do it tomorrow.
MS. HAJJAR: Now, these messages, Agent Rees, if you just refer back to the top of this page.
The defendant says: Can you have the thing for reversing the situation with Jim done in an hour?
And based on the context of the messages here, is this referring to a letter to Jim?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to the next, to page 67 of the same exhibit.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: February 6th, 1108, a.m.
If you have a choice of having sex with Jim or me, who would you choose? It still has the same problem. I sent you back one. I am so sad you didn't write it. Please answer my question. Just send the second draft that contains all necessary therapeutic elements. Please answer my question. It is insulting when you wait.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: I'm going to turn and direct your attention to what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 1784.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, in had the e-mails that you've reviewed from vicibaby@gmail.com, are there drafts of letters addressed to Jim sent between KeithRaniere@yahoo.com and Camila?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there are.
MS. HAJJAR: If you could just scroll down to the bottom, Ms. Carby, thank you.
MS. HAJJAR: This is a -- the e-mail at the bottom. Can you read the time and the first paragraph, please.
MAEGAN REES: On Tuesday, February 16th, 2016, at 6:31 p.m., Vicibaby@gmail.com wrote:
Who are the biggest changers? It is still disorganized despite that but wanted your thoughts before I moved stuff.
In blue: I don't blame you, I blame myself but either way, I can't be around you. I thought we were in the same page about what happened and there was nothing further that needed to be said, but there were several interactions during this past training that make me think this is not the case.
MS. HAJJAR: Now, Agent Rees, are there many e-mails back and forth around this time period with Cami and KeithRaniere@yahoo.com?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there are.
MS. HAJJAR: And are they drafts of a letter like similar to the content of this the text of this e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: Based on the context of those messages and this one, can you explain what's going on with the text in blue and the text in black?
MAEGAN REES: Cami is writing an e-mail to Jim regarding sexual contact that the two of them had. She sends these e-mails to Keith and he provides edits.
MS. HAJJAR: So if we could just scroll up slightly on the same page.
This top e-mail is an e-mail to Keith Raniere from Cami and it has certain changes.
Can you read the first paragraph, please?
MAEGAN REES: Hi Jim. I was uncomfortable with some of the interactions during the intensive and the vibe that I'm getting from you. I just want to clarify a few things.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read the text of this e-mail, please?
MAEGAN REES: I left a lot of things unsaid that should have been said. I should have written this long ago, but seeing you in the training made me realize how I clearly feel about you and what I did. I will no longer let it go unsaid.
Last year there were many times I failed to do what was right with you. I made many bad decisions and I let my fears and my insecurities cloud my judgment. I feel bad that I let it go as far as it did and I didn't stop it much sooner. I feel embarrassed now every time I look at you because I felt forced to let you touch me unless I felt forced to take off the bra so you wouldn't hurt yourself.
I took off the bra because I felt I had no choice, not because I actually wanted you to touch me. Every moment felt like an out-of-body moment, car crash, disaster and I couldn't stop. Being liked was a big factor in my decisions and I just don't -- when I took it all the way to that moment. I liked that you liked me. It felt good, but I did not want to be sexual with you.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, I'm just going to pause there.
Are there many more iterations of this letter in e-mails back and forth between Keith Raniere and Camila?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there are.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. And are there many references to this letter also in the chats that you've reviewed, the WhatsApp chats?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there are.
MS. HAJJAR: I'm going to -- if you could just read the last line in blue. It's the second page of Government Exhibit 1784?
(Exhibit published.)
MAEGAN REES: I hope from now we can be cordial if we do cross paths but I will choose to refrain from interacting with you unless absolutely needed.
MS. HAJJAR: So I'm going to turn to page 71 of -- actually, skip ahead to page 35 of Government Exhibit 301-R.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: February 7th, 8:52 p.m.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: I refuse. Good-bye, that's just too prideful, untrue and entitled?
MAEGAN REES: This is what you just presented. How many options are you leaving me?
MS. HAJJAR: You are the abuser. If there is such a thing as unfair, you are taking and destroying it.
MAEGAN REES: I could argue that, but it is not that important right now.
MS. HAJJAR: Return everything you destroyed. Feel the same pain as me. You can keep all of the other benefits and we will call it starting to be fair. You can't really argue that. You're wrong.
MAEGAN REES: I only have one option. I seriously feel like you are going to hunt me down and make my life a living hell if I don't choose what you want.
MS. HAJJAR: I can see you at around 9:30, for sex, for a reason. You need to not be prideful and lovingly satisfy me. Let's see if you can.
MS. HAJJAR: Turn to the next page which is Government Exhibit 302-R, page 76.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read the highlighted portion for Camila?
MAEGAN REES: 8:59 p.m.
No, no, no. I don't mean to say that it is fair based on what I did to you. I did something awful to you. That is not fair. You're left at a disadvantage in that regard. What I am saying is not fair is your position in the organization and your power versus mine. You have already said that there will be lots of shit. I don't want to have sex like that. That seems awful. Well, we'll see if I can satisfy you.
MS. HAJJAR: I earned my power and earned it by using it justly. There is nothing unfair about our relative positions. You give me nothing. I give you much because of those relative positions. You had one thing you gave me to hold all of the benefits. You gave that away and still, and can't give it to me. By rights, you should not ever have had the benefits.
MS. HAJJAR: Just the same page, page -- at 2:04 a.m.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read Camila's portion, please.
MAEGAN REES: By the way, I never wanted you to correct me. That's one of the things are anger me. That because you know more than you think, you have the authority to correct me, whether asked for help or not. It angers me that you think everything right and cause me no pain in our years together. I felt jerked around most of the time. It angers me that you did not uphold what I thought you claimed. I remember being in awe of you for being willing to step down for someone else if I loved them. I'm angry that you disguised things as logical and righteous when sometimes they are just emotional and human. I'm angry that you crippled me for so many years and now use that handicap against me. I am angry that you made me believe in fairy tales and the blueprints when it is all a lie. I am angry that you moved your entire life and planned my life without my consent, and that all those things were your choice, but blame me for them when I didn't even know what you were doing. I'm angry that because of you, I have no close relationships because I always had to lie to them about this other part of my life. I am angry that because of you I am such a good liar.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read this.
MAEGAN REES: I am angry that because of you I started my bulimia and I am angry that for so long you completely ignored it when I desperately needed help. I'm angry you now use it against me. I am angry at you because I always felt I wasn't good enough because I couldn't understand why you needed to be with other women and not just be with me. I am angry I lost so many years of common learning experiences because of you. I am angry at you because you couldn't see how being with me at such a young age was probably taking away from my life and opportunities. And I am just plain sad to learn that love is not that poetic something that is so deep and indescribable but, in fact, a trade. For so many years I forgot about the darkness. I thought the world was bright and beautiful and I'm angry that in the last few months I've contemplated suicide countless times and everything is done.
MS. HAJJAR: The same -- the next page, same exhibit. February 8th, 4:34 a.m.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: I took great pains to legitimize our relationship from the start. I asked permission from both your sisters. I kept on asking you why you turned out different from them, et cetera. From this I gained a type of earned authority. When Hoyboy happened, we spoke at length about the nature of consequences and extra time which needed to be added on, et cetera. I told you at Toni Natalie and how I took on a great weight to rehabilitate her word, et cetera.
I told her it would be about seven years to do this. I told you the same, but I told you I would build a life so that when the test came, if you passed it, we would be free of my life responsibilities that stood in our way. There was a lot more to this. When I saw the morality results from V week, I was shocked. You had a preconventional outlook.
If I really did start with you too young, I lose all authority on which our whole relationship was based and my definition of love and my belief in women. Everyone had betrayed me except you and your sister and beauty, et cetera.
If my authority rests on this fault, I can't use it beside all the penance activity I've already started here's the irony. If you had dropped your pride at any moment, at any point, and listened to me, I could have rehabilitated everything. If you didn't listen to me, things will go as they do and you will not get enough pain to match my pain and thereby never be aware of what you do and not build a big enough conscience.
I hoped, if you just you surrendered your pride this hell would end. That was true. But I can't lie. You now have a reason to keep your pride. Pride doesn't go away by itself. Only through both extreme pain and humiliation. But your pride has won. It owns me. I can't argue that point if it's true. I no longer have the authority to help. Both of us are now subject to your pride as king.
I need to be king to fix this and defeat your pride. I still, I can still demand certain exchanges, but I can no longer help you. The base of my ascension to a trusted fake authority to guide us has been destroyed by this fact. I took every precaution I could, but your belief says I failed. To get rid of your pride, you must view me as infallible in this area.
THE COURT: All right. I think we will take our lunch break now.
All rise for the jury.
COURT CLERK: All rise.
(Jury exits.)
(In open court; outside the presence of the jury.)
THE COURT: All right. The witness may stand down. Do not discuss your testimony with anyone.
We will take an hour for lunch.
(Continued on following page with AFTERNOON SESSION.)
AFTERNOON SESSION
(In open court; jury not present.)
(Judge Nicholas G. Garaufis enters the courtroom.)
THE COURT: All right bring in the witness, please.
(Witness takes stand.)
THE COURT: Please bring in the jury.
(Jury enters the courtroom.)
THE COURT: Please be seated.
You may continue with your examination of your witness, Ms. Hajjar.
I remind the witness she is still under oath.
MAEGAN REES: Yes, Your Honor.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Good afternoon, Agent Rees.
MAEGAN REES: Good afternoon.
MS. HAJJAR: Now, Agent Rees, I am going to direct your attention to what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 302-R, page 95, and on February 10, 3:40 p.m., Keith Raniere:
Did you keep the hair? They're supposed to be mine.
MAEGAN REES: I know. I didn't think of that until after. I didn't. I'm so sorry.
MS. HAJJAR: How did you fix? How much did you trim? Where?
MAEGAN REES: Just the long parts that were pulling on me.
MS. HAJJAR: How do you make this up to me? There is the issue of your hair, but there are two more important issues; your word you wouldn't, also that you didn't think of me and save it. How can you experience enough pain so it matches mine plus some and you wouldn't do that class of transgressions ever again?
Now, Agent Rees, this discussion of hair, cutting hair, is that a theme that features a lot in these messages that you have reviewed?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it is.
MS. HAJJAR: And I'm turning to the next slide which has excerpts of some of these messages.
Can you describe the type of messages that deal with cutting hair, alterations to hair?
MAEGAN REES: At some point throughout the WhatsApp conversations, Camilla will talk about wanting to change her hairstyle or haircut or how she maintains hair on her body, in which Keith Raniere demands to know how she's going to change it, why and often advises her against it.
MS. HAJJAR: And are these messages excerpted from December 30 and 31st about Camilla dying her hair and the Defendant's responses?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: I am going to turn to Government Exhibit 302-R.
If we can start at February 12, 3:30 p.m., and if you could read the highlighted portion?
MAEGAN REES: I'm trying to do what's right here.
MS. HAJJAR: Not true. If I were coaching someone and heard this, it would be chilling.
MAEGAN REES: You really want me to be that horrible person you made up in your mind. You are wrong.
MS. HAJJAR: Chilling.
MAEGAN REES: Yeah, you can say that to anything anyone says and it is very powerful with little backup, like saying something is evil or a cult.
MS. HAJJAR: Please move out. Sadly, I'm correct.
MAEGAN REES: Please don't assume anything in my tongue. I'm trying to do the right thing.
MS. HAJJAR: No, you are very far away from that. I believe that it is beyond you.
MAEGAN REES: I can and will move out, but I don't want you to think that I am bad, scary, or anything you are thinking I am.
MS. HAJJAR: Move out.
MAEGAN REES: Immature, maybe. No, definitely immature.
MS. HAJJAR: No, and I need to act accordingly. Immature do not do these things.
MAEGAN REES: Since when do you lose hope in people?
MS. HAJJAR: When they damage too much and demonstrate they won't change, can't change or too prideful to change. I am responsible to many others.
MAEGAN REES: What are you doing? What am I missing? This seems to be the worst thing you can do to a human being to pass a verdict such as this, especially when you are wrong, especially when there was hope.
MS. HAJJAR: This is the hardest and harshest thing for me to do. It is the last ethical resort. I'm not wrong about my verdict with respect to my process. This is what counts. My process may be imperfect, but the mistakes are outweighed by the right thing to do. If I were wrong about you, you would be saying and doing far different things. It seems everything you are doing is supporting this verdict, not saying something is one of those things.
MAEGAN REES: I am researching methods.
MS. HAJJAR: Methods of?
MAEGAN REES: To die. Of what you say is true and there is no hope, then there is no point for me to be around. I can't put others in danger.
MS. HAJJAR: More of the same response; you'd rather die than do the right things or break your pride. Breaking your pride at this point would be assuming you are wrong completely.
Agent Rees, when the defendant says you'd rather die or break your pride, were there frequent references to pride in the messages that you reviewed?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there were.
MS. HAJJAR: I am going to turn to the next slide and this is slide 107.
Does this have excerpts of some of those messages from Government Exhibit 301?
MAEGAN REES: That is correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And the references to bad pride, pride, too much pride, pride and anger, being too prideful?
MAEGAN REES: Correct.
MS. HAJJAR: This is from Government Exhibit 301, the next slide and certain excerpts, December 10, 2014, 1:23 a.m.:
How are these rules insane? I'm going to need to stop for tonight, this is too tiring. We're so far apart and can't see you changing. At this point I believe you are prideful. I won't fight pride. I am leaning towards walking away.
And then the following excerpts again refer to -- Keith Raniere referring to pride?
MAEGAN REES: Correct.
MS. HAJJAR: I am going to skip to page 143 of Government Exhibit 302-R. At the top, February 20, 5:02 p.m., Keith Raniere:
You're cooking for people is involved in a few ways with your breaches.
MAEGAN REES: Question mark. I have no money.
MS. HAJJAR: There are other ways. I told you I would pay for legitimate work. I will have to pay someone else if not you. I pay more. You're settling for low pay work for your time.
MAEGAN REES: I thought you took that off the table. I am more than game for that.
MS. HAJJAR: I think you should not cook for anyone but me and do my work that I need.
MAEGAN REES: Game. I committed to it already.
MS. HAJJAR: Uncommit and get someone else. I'm very concerned about tonight because the Jim thing is not resolved and he will be there.
MAEGAN REES: I'm feeling a bit thwarted with these things. These are things that develop skills to generate options to earn in the future. Why do you want me to not have that?
MS. HAJJAR: My things develop better skills.
MAEGAN REES: Options. Options. Your thing is dependent on you.
MS. HAJJAR: And past 144, page 148, and looking at 153. This is February 22, 12:25 p.m., Keith Raniere:
I've taken on too much, my body is not supporting it.
MAEGAN REES: What's going on?
MS. HAJJAR: For some reason my phone was not sending or receiving. I'm really bleeding.
MAEGAN REES: Mine too.
MS. HAJJAR: I need you to drop your pride and love me purely.
MAEGAN REES: Literally bleeding?
MS. HAJJAR: Yes.
MAEGAN REES: Do you need me to call anyone?
MS. HAJJAR: No, it won't help.
MAEGAN REES: Will you be okay?
MS. HAJJAR: I have many doctors at my disposal. I don't know. Every time you're angry or prideful, I take on more.
Agent Rees, the last message of this particular attachment is on March fourth?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: So, showing you what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 1753, is this another e-mail from Camilla to Camilla attaching a WhatsApp chat with an unknown caller?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it is.
MS. HAJJAR: What's the date of this e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: March 15, 2015.
MS. HAJJAR: And looking at the beginning of the first page of the attachment, does that leave off where the last exhibit ended?
MAEGAN REES: It does.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to page 5 of Government Exhibit 1753, March 6, 2:26 p.m., Keith Raniere:
Did you make a life commitment to me yesterday?
MAEGAN REES: Yes and no. Please explain. I am scared shitless and feel a loss, but at the same time it is the best gift I could give you and us. I am telling you that you are more important than happiness, kids, the house, the job. I hold you higher than any of those. That is how much I want love to weigh in me, more than anything. That is why yes and no. I am saying goodbye to everything I want, but I know that I am choosing love and now I know how valuable I want it to be. So yes, I made a life commitment.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. I am going to skip ahead to page 25 and starting from March 12, 8:56 p.m., Keith Raniere:
Good method. I am in a far more intense situation. I love more and stronger. I sacrificed far more. I've lived far longer and you are far more selective and the stuff you don't understand you were my parampara and my purpose is diminished because of it.
MAEGAN REES: You're what? Parampara?
MS. HAJJAR: Spiritual successor through transmission of energy and innate knowledge. My lineage is not supposed to end with my death. It will likely now which diminishes my purpose and its strength. I may not live too long once a few more things are finished.
MAEGAN REES: I can't even breathe when you say that much less say anything.
MS. HAJJAR: What do you mean?
MAEGAN REES: It is beyond heartbreaking. It is terrifying, paralyzing, overwhelming, sad, frightening. Brings deep, hard emotions.
MS. HAJJAR: It is what is. There were three paths. One, if I didn't find a parampara, I would live an extended life. Two, finding a parampara, my life would also live through her with me as her. Three, I start to go through the process which mortally weakens me and then it is cut off and my purpose for being here is thwarted.
MAEGAN REES: This is beyond my comprehension, but it is important to you.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, have you also reviewed additional WhatsApp messages between Camilla and Robbie Chiappone?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, that's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: I'm showing you what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 1754.
Is this another e-mail attaching WhatsApp messages between Camilla and Robbie?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: I'm going to show you a few of these messages, but they are similar as to the ones we have already reviewed?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: I'm now showing you Government Exhibit 307-R, page 15, at the bottom, March 26, 10:20 p.m.
Can you start reading from the highlighted portion, please?
MAEGAN REES: Did you know I worked with Nancy today?
MS. HAJJAR: No. Is that who you EM'd with?
MAEGAN REES: What have you told her about me? Or why would she know that we are close or that I've changed my thought object of you?
MS. HAJJAR: Nothing. She knows we are close. I've always maintained to everyone, including your sister, that I believed I was always the closest person to you and that we had a unique bond because I have always said that during the years. I helped you a lot and did many things for you. I have no idea about the thought object thing. Was your EM about me?
Now, turning to the next page, page 16 at 11:48 p.m., can you read the highlighted text?
MAEGAN REES: I'm never sure how to sanitize to work on stuff related to you. It made me very uncomfortable when Nancy mentioned you.
MS. HAJJAR: Nancy has always known there was something extraordinary between us.
MAEGAN REES: Yeah, but how did she know to bring it up?
MS. HAJJAR: I can only guess. I can ask. My assumption is you either said something about me or I was conspicuously absent at some point. One of the things we see is conspicuous absence.
MAEGAN REES: Question mark. Conspicuous absence?
MS. HAJJAR: Yes. A person speaks in a context and distinctly does mention something that should be there. If you were speaking about the closest people to you and you didn't mention me, it would raise the question.
MAEGAN REES: I wasn't.
MS. HAJJAR: All right, I am going to turn to Government Exhibit 308-R.
Again, is this an e-mail from Camilla to Camilla attaching the WhatsApp chat with unknown caller?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to page 15, starting at the top, April 7, 5:17 p.m., can you read the highlighted portion of Camilla?
MAEGAN REES: I will text on the life commitment although it's pretty long.
MS. HAJJAR: Long, detailed, firm commitments are good. Long texts are what I hope for. What have you been doing? What happened to the long text?
MAEGAN REES: It's coming.
MS. HAJJAR: Are you home all night?
MAEGAN REES: The life commitment is a process thing. There was something during emphasis, whether either said it or I interpret it. Like I had to lose hope. So I realize that as long as I kept waiting for you, our year to be up -- I'm sorry, as long as I kept waiting for our year to be up, I would never feel the pain of your loss. Up until that point, I had been waiting for the year to be up, waiting to be set free. Giving you my life was my way of removing all possible escape routes. It was also because I wanted it to symbolize how much I can value something even beyond happiness, life, children, the house or the career?
MS. HAJJAR: I think I understand. So what is the exact full commitment?
MAEGAN REES: The part that I struggle with is that I thought I'd be in love with you again after making that commitment and couldn't hurt you any more. The reason that I was dubious after that was because now you are stuck with me, only to continue to be hurt. The feelings didn't follow as I thought they would.
MS. HAJJAR: You have to work to repair them. It would be nice if breaches allowed for effortless repair. Actually, that would be terrible because nothing would have value. In this case the effort you put in to repair this love would be the value and strength of your love. No effort in it means nothing. How strong and valuable do you want your love to be. The commitment gives the opportunity to have a valuable love. Without it, you are just waiting a year at giving me, you, us love, none of it.
So am I to assume you will never leave me, never be with anyone else no matter what?
MAEGAN REES: I feel like I just died a little bit with that question.
MS. HAJJAR: I thought that was your commitment. Wouldn't you have died all the way when you made it?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, you just reminded me, it feels like death.
MS. HAJJAR: Why?
MAEGAN REES: It feels like everything is pointless, like there is no more seeking anything. I should just accept that this is it.
MS. HAJJAR: Do you want me to stop in?
MAEGAN REES: You can if you want.
MS. HAJJAR: Noncommittal answer, I won't then. I am really having trouble with your noncommitalness [sic] and lethargy. Today was open and important day for us to spend time, but you need desire to spend time and make it good so you can repair love. Every time you miss an opportunity you make it worse. You are either building or destroying like sinking, swimming, there is no in between. Today you made it worse. Ideally, you would have pushed hard to see me. Even when I finally asked, you did not value an opportunity to see a valuable person, me. You took it for granted and said if I wanted. No one in the organization would respond that way to me. For to them, I'm important. To you, I'm not.
MAEGAN REES: I said you could.
MS. HAJJAR: That's not the point. That's very out of cause and/or devaluing.
MAEGAN REES: Question mark.
MS. HAJJAR: Other people would say yes, that would be fantastic, I would love to see you.
MAEGAN REES: Okay. I really did not think you wanted me to treat you like the leader of the organization. We had a romantic relationship. You are that to me first and then Vanguard.
MS. HAJJAR: You're right. You should treat me even better.
MAEGAN REES: But I will absolutely abide by that. I will treat you like anyone else if that is what you want.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. I am going to turn to page 49 of the same exhibit, from the bottom, April 19, 8:00 p.m., Keith Raniere:
I'm sorry, I'm working too hard at this. My time right now is almost up. Why won't you stay on line, don't forget my other question. Last time I can call tonight.
MAEGAN REES: I need to correct something I said, but don't know if I should do it in person. I am afraid it means the worst and I'm sorry I lied.
MS. HAJJAR: I am going to skip to the -- well, Agent Rees in your -- are there lots of references in these messages you have reviewed to the vow and making a life commitment?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there are.
MS. HAJJAR: And interspersed with these messages are there discussions of R or Robbie?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct, there are.
MS. HAJJAR: And, so, turning to page 50 at the top, 8:06 p.m. April 19, Keith Raniere: Happened twice?
MAEGAN REES: Three.
MS. HAJJAR: Anything else that is bad? Three in the one night or two and once in the car?
MAEGAN REES: The latter.
MS. HAJJAR: Why would you not do that with me?
MAEGAN REES: I don't know how to answer that.
MS. HAJJAR: Honestly?
MAEGAN REES: Physical attraction.
MS. HAJJAR: It was false, unfortunately. Is he circumcised?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: I'm sorry, I'm in such pain. Please write me an extensive plan. I don't know what to do about oral sex. It's vitally important but our -- I will likely stop texting suddenly. Don't stop.
What underwear did you wear?
MAEGAN REES: Physical stuff, that's it? Didn't.
MS. HAJJAR: What outerwear? Not only physical stuff.
MAEGAN REES: I think jeans and a T-shirt.
MS. HAJJAR: How quickly do you think you can make it far more primal with me?
MAEGAN REES: No clue.
MS. HAJJAR: And then, turning to page 51, April 19th, 8:31 p.m., Keith Raniere:
Will you please make your plan extensive. I don't know if I can or should have sex with you because it will -- it has to make that all worse.
MAEGAN REES: I will.
MS. HAJJAR: Also about the sex, I don't know what to do. You need to decide. Sex is very important, especially now. Coming in you and in your mouth is vitally important, but you have to like everything better about it and I can't reconcile that. Question mark.
MAEGAN REES: I thought you were not asking anything.
MS. HAJJAR: Help me with the sex.
MAEGAN REES: Okay.
MS. HAJJAR: Please include near-term sex in your plan. Text me when you're up.
MAEGAN REES: Sort of.
MS. HAJJAR: If you could just scroll down and if you could read the highlighted portion starting at 11:39 p.m.?
MAEGAN REES: April 19th: Yeah, but I will. Plan. Letter. Pledge. Robbie. Lot of sex. Blow jobs. Making you my hero. Dressing sexy for you. Losing weight. Keeping house clean. Cooking. Date nights. Disclose everything. Delete tender. Clean thought object with Lucy.
MS. HAJJAR: 11:40 p.m., April 19th, Keith Raniere:
Why delete tender? I think that might be the wrong thing to do. I hope you can undelete.
MAEGAN REES: Because of the way I use it, the feelings are not in line. I can reinstall. Why? Didn't get it.
MS. HAJJAR: And then can you just look at the bottom, April 19th, 11:48 p.m., Keith Raniere:
What happened with first batch of women?
MAEGAN REES: I didn't pursue, so they probably forgot about me.
MS. HAJJAR: Have you pursued anyone?
MAEGAN REES: I've chatted with a few girls, I've gotten a couple of numbers.
MS. HAJJAR: Skipping to the next page, April 20, 1:52 p.m., Keith Raniere:
Today, as soon as possible, write me this committed life vow in paragraph form and swear it with your sacred honor, for better or for worse, forever, please, including compete honesty, obedience, surrender, et cetera.
I'm going to turn to page 63, April 25, 12:26 a.m., Keith Raniere:
The wound is so deep and essential. Have you finished vow, letter, plan, in that order?
MAEGAN REES: Not yet.
MS. HAJJAR: The vow can uplift us and me.
MAEGAN REES: Was the vow I sent insufficient?
MS. HAJJAR: Have you finished any? Worked on them?
MAEGAN REES: Haven't finished them.
MS. HAJJAR: And then turning to the next page, 12:31 a.m., Keith Raniere -- this is in response to what did I miss, by Camilla:
Specifically giving yourself totally, control, ownership, body, emotions, life, et cetera, forever, as much as you can imagine to say. If you come up with things beyond what I have contemplated, I would feel even better. Go all the way, make it everything, like no other human in history has given themselves as completely to another. Make our love that important.
MAEGAN REES: I vow to forever be yours in heart and spirit and for as long as the physical world will allow in body. I vow to have your back in battle and in peace. I vow to always let you in and treat you as a friend. I vow to only speak your name if I'm speaking of love.
What else do you want? This includes everything.
MS. HAJJAR: I vow to be yours and for you to have me and do with me as you would. I will obey you and trust you absolutely and irrevocably. I vow to have you as my master in all things and in all ways?
MAEGAN REES: You're pushing too much.
MS. HAJJAR: The problem is there shouldn't be a too much and you should be pushing me. Maybe this just can't work. Maybe is needed at this point is a total surrender of everything, joyfully, with no pride. If you feel I could even push too much, I should shut this door. Today has been the hardest night of my life. You value our love by what you give. Can I really push too much? Even if you give me everything it is not enough, but I accept it because it is all you have, I can take no less. It is not right. So show me?
MAEGAN REES: I vow to be yours and for you to have me and do with me as you would. I will obey you and trust you absolutely and irrevocably. I vow to have you as my master in all things and in all ways.
MS. HAJJAR: Do you understand why you do this and do it out of love? I love you, but in or for me to accept this vow because I cannot trust you, I need extreme collateral to be used if the vow is broken. This need to be large enough so the vow will never be broken and different types of punishment for counter/bad behaviors. Through this you can repair and earn the love you destroyed, build self-esteem and become self-reliant and humble. This type of reward/punishment creates a self-esteem building system similar to what boys go through if they reach manhood. Come up with these things. Punishment levels: One, used frequently for minor infractions or suboptimum behavior. Two, used infrequently for true infractions. Three, even less frequent used for bad infractions. Four, extreme for very bad behavior. Five, the ultimate short of taking collateral, hopefully never used but an important reality. The world is full of these.
(Continued on following page.)
EXAMINATION CONTINUES BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: I'm turning to page 66, at the top.
Can you read the portion starting at 5:15 p.m.?
MAEGAN REES: Why did you leave this time?
MS. HAJJAR: Your lowless. You do not have state control, which means you have little self-awareness. Is this what you offer me as inducement to accept your vow?
I am going to skip ahead to 7:52 p.m. at the bottom.
Okay, when are you back? Will you complete the vow and related things, the letter and the plan? Will you be great for me and give me the you I deserve. Home?
I'm sorry, I don't trust you. You should have been eager to see me. You haven't contacted me, so I am concerned you are not home and with others. I tried calling.
MAEGAN REES: I know.
MS. HAJJAR: You know what? Are you home?
MAEGAN REES: That you called and that you don't trust me.
MS. HAJJAR: I am going to skip to the following page, April 26th, 3:47 p.m. [sic].
Can you read Camila's text, please?
MAEGAN REES: What now? Just take the vow.
MS. HAJJAR: In order for me to speak to you ever again, I need to video all of our conversations at will. I experience you as childish, defiant, disrespectful and hateful. I experience you use many strategies of blame at out of causedness in a very mean way towards me. It must stop from your heart. This is the only way because you are not nice to me and I can no longer trust you. I need an answer now or there are no more options.
And so, Agent Rees, you testified that interspersed with the references to the vow and to Camila's commitment, there are discussions of R?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you describe the nature of the conversations about R?
MAEGAN REES: Obsessive.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. I am turning to the next page, page 68 of 308-R. It's April 28th, 4:34 p.m.
Keith Raniere: Why haven't you insisted on swallowing me since you did so with R? I can't keep calling you. I want you to force yourself to stay connected.
MAEGAN REES: I haven't wanted it. I've been intimate with you without pushing me away. That's big.
MS. HAJJAR: That's the worst news of all. His sperm and DNA should be disgusting and invasive. You should have want to do anything to love mine, to try to save what is left of a connection.
Do you like his fluid more than mine?
MAEGAN REES: Right now, neither.
MS. HAJJAR: Did you ever prefer his taste, et cetera, over mine?
MAEGAN REES: Why do you want me to answer that?
MS. HAJJAR: Please don't question me like this anymore. I can't tell you the reasons. Please answer.
MAEGAN REES: If I didn't, I wouldn't have chosen to be with him.
MS. HAJJAR: You chose to be with him because you liked the taste of his semen better? ? ???
MAEGAN REES: No.
MS. HAJJAR: Then what do you mean?
MAEGAN REES: But if I disliked it, I would have avoided it.
MS. HAJJAR: I asked specifically about taste. Did you specifically mention to him you liked it??
MAEGAN REES: I can't remember.
MS. HAJJAR: I need you to.
MAEGAN REES: Probably.
MS. HAJJAR: What did you like?
MAEGAN REES: Seriously? I'm hesitant to share this with you.
MS. HAJJAR: I need everything. This is explicitly in the letter I wrote. For me to do anything more with you I need to know you want to tell me all.
And then at the top of page 69, the same exhibit.
MAEGAN REES: Does that mean you accepted the vow?
MS. HAJJAR: No. You keep giving me reasons not to. I keep telling you want I need that is different. Did you like his taste better than mine?
MAEGAN REES: I wish I didn't have to answer this. Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: The wish thing hurts us. What did you like better?
MAEGAN REES: Taste, consistency, quantity, intensity.
MS. HAJJAR: What about each of these things?
MAEGAN REES: Taste; he is mild and sweet. Consistency; not too concentrated. Quantity; small amount. Intensity; strong release speed.
I am sorry you had to hear that.
MS. HAJJAR: He is shorter and thinner penis-wise?
MAEGAN REES: Longer, but thinner.
MS. HAJJAR: Is he longer when I'm fully hard?
MAEGAN REES: Probably about same.
MS. HAJJAR: Did he hit the back of you?
MAEGAN REES: Question mark.
MS. HAJJAR: Last spring?
MAEGAN REES: Oh, I can't remember.
MS. HAJJAR: I am examining perception. I know his penis is 6.75 fully erect and mine is 7.5, so I am looking at how you are slanting things.
MAEGAN REES: What the fuck? How do you know that?
MS. HAJJAR: Likewise with intensity. You forget our passionate times and compare our day-to-day and in the last year I've been heartbroken and could barely function.
MAEGAN REES: Why does this matter?
MS. HAJJAR: Maybe some day I'll tell you, but guys know these things about each other.
MAEGAN REES: How?
MS. HAJJAR: Later.
MAEGAN REES: I thought men did share these things.
MS. HAJJAR: How are you going to fix this? Men masturbate together.
MAEGAN REES: No way. Have you masturbated with him?
MS. HAJJAR: They don't share about their women, but themselves is different.
MAEGAN REES: Have you seen his penis?
MS. HAJJAR: His is definitely not the width or length of mine. How are you going to fix this lie?
MAEGAN REES: You haven't been at your fullest in a long time. It isn't a lie.
MS. HAJJAR: That is the problem. Your whole memory of him is a lie. The time before last I was easily longer than him. I kept hitting the back of you, remember? You came twice.
MAEGAN REES: How can I forget? But you were hitting the tender spots on the sides. I never come because you hit the back. That has never been the case.
MS. HAJJAR: It is highly doubtful he was even close to as sweet. I actually have a very strong basis for that. Mild maybe... Less volume definitely, but you put less volume as a plus. It is always a minus because I can put the rest elsewhere.
No, most people don't come because of the back, I was just pointing out I was 7.5 that morning.
MAEGAN REES: To be honest, this isn't that important to me. You're bigger and better in every way, I'm sure of it.
MS. HAJJAR: I don't believe you're sure of it, but the taste has a special significance. All of these things can be altered: Length, width, intensity, taste, even to some degree volume. But there is an important factor in taste that is essential and that you have increased that sex so much and still protect the lie.
I can challenge the lie on measurables, but not the measurables that you must do. This is mostly measurable because if the lie you created real passion -- because of the lie you created real passion, because of real passion you grossly exaggerated the experience.
How are you going to fix that? The "and" after essential can be deleted and a new sentence started?
??
MAEGAN REES: I don't care who's better or bigger. You do. Take it, hon. And yes, I am sure that you are superior.
MS. HAJJAR: What do you mean, take it?
MAEGAN REES: The crown. The official title. I will attest to that.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, is this only one example of the type of conversation about R that you've reviewed in these messages?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it is.
MS. HAJJAR: Now, after April 26th and after messages relating to the vow, is there some discussion in the messages of an injury that Camila sustained?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there are.
MS. HAJJAR: And I am turning to page 71 of Government Exhibit 308-R. At the top: How does the injury feel?
And then: I examined it. I wish you would allow Nancy to examine it. You cut completely through the dermis. Ideally could use treatment.
Have you reviewed images from the vicibaby account that reflects injury?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, I have.
MS. HAJJAR: And around this time?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: I am going to skip to Government Exhibit 1779.
Is this another e-mail from Camila to Camila attaching a text file called "WhatsApp Chat with Unknown Caller"?
MAEGAN REES: Correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And I am going to ask you to read the portion on page 2, starting April 27th, 2015 at 9:20 a.m.
MAEGAN REES: Can we work something out? I value everything you have created and provide. I don't ever want to hurt you or your creation. I can see why you wouldn't want me around with something like last night. I will seek professional help. I will also commit to working on my deeper anger with the tech.
Can you please not send me back to Mexico?
My dream was to do something to help change the way we educate children. If I am no good there and have nothing to contribute, then I will step down. Please don't send me back to Mexico. I will leave Rainbow completely if that's what you think is best.
I don't want to be in Mexico, my family and loved ones are here. I appreciate the community you have created and the values they represent. Please.
MS. HAJJAR: And at the end the page there is another. Can you read from 5:22 p.m., the same exhibit?
MAEGAN REES: It is a proposal because I am putting up some and compromising some. But I am asking for some, too. That's why I hesitate. If I were delivering everything you have ever asked for, I wouldn't call it a proposal. I do think you'll like it, though.
MS. HAJJAR: On April 27th, 2015, 5:32 p.m.
Keith Raniere: Okay. I'm not sure of the time yet.
What are you asking for in the proposal?
MAEGAN REES: To not go to Mexico.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay, we'll talk.
Then turning to page 46 of the same exhibit. May 23rd, 2015 , 11:12 p.m.
Keith Raniere: To have a life committed love relationship, and to suffer a mutual adversity that destroys that commitment in 90 days or less makes a life commitment not very permanent or valuable. It makes such a commitment, built over 8.5 years not really important. We make our commitments important by how we handle them.
Then turning to page 82 of the same exhibit. Can you read from the highlighted portion, please?
MAEGAN REES: June 10th, 2015, 10:23 a.m.: Re the collateral. I discussed with Dani making it that I would leave Rainbow and could not have any further interactions with the kids.
MS. HAJJAR: Does this include a hundred percent loyalty, commitment and obedience forever?
MAEGAN REES: Yes. Do you want/need a letter of resignation drawn up for the collateral?
MS. HAJJAR: If you would, I love you to type these things also in vow form.
MAEGAN REES: What does that mean?
MS. HAJJAR: Whatever you want. Give me everything, your heart, your body, your mind, your soul.
Are there a lot, just because there are some excerpts, but have you reviewed many messages in this time period relating to collateral or the vow?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, I have.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. And so, July 8th, 2015, 9:13 a.m.
Keith Raniere: Finish the vow.
MAEGAN REES: Question mark. I thought I had already taken the vow.
MS. HAJJAR: Yes. Finish it formally with collateral.
And then the same page, 9:16 a.m.
Keith Raniere: Do I get to put a permanent ankle bracelet on you or something? I'm sorry to ask this, did R poke the opening of your vagina with his penis?
Then below that July 30, 2015, 5:49 p.m.: When shall we do the collateral and formalize the vow?
MAEGAN REES: Whenever you want.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you resend me copy of the vow?
Then turning to August 3rd, 2015, 11:40 p.m.
Can you read the highlighted portion?
MAEGAN REES: By the way, can we go over collateral? And I wanted to know if you consider the vow official or if there is anything else you need from me.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read that last excerpt, please?
MAEGAN REES: August -- I believe that says 6, sorry, it's a little fuzzy, 2015, 2:08 a.m.
I would love to have a collateral all set. Wanna peek? Would love your thoughts.
MS. HAJJAR: Yes.
MAEGAN REES: When would you like it, hon? I have three already, but they are not very meaty, but the essence is there. I could use some feedback to best phrase it.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to page 179, can you just read the first portion that's highlighted, the first three messages?
MAEGAN REES: August 7th, 2015 at 7:46 p.m.: I didn't say walking with our baby because I don't know that you would still want to have kids with me now that I damaged my purity... but it is another fantasy. I can see why my mom or just people would choose to get lost in mysticism. It makes things less painful. It gives painful things: Events, mistakes, losses, meaning. It feels like it wasn't in vein. I am at a loss for words at the moment, but I am here thinking of you.
MS. HAJJAR: And the rest of these exchange and messages, and the ones on the following page, are these more messages relating details of Robbie, of R, and his relationship with Camila?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to page 189, August 12th, 2015, 6:16 p.m.
Keith Raniere: I was very moved by your collateral. I'm still thinking about it. Your.
MAEGAN REES: It just needs to be signed, witnessed and notarized and then we can consummate our vows (well, my vow to you.)
MS. HAJJAR: At around this time period and a little bit before, Agent Rees, have you reviewed e-mails from this vicibaby@gmail.com e-mail relating to what's being described as Camila's collateral?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, I have.
MS. HAJJAR: So turning to Government Exhibit 1767, this is from vicibaby@gmail.com. When is it sent?
MAEGAN REES: It does not appear that it was sent.
MS. HAJJAR: The sent, the date?
MAEGAN REES: Oh, I'm sorry. July 22nd, 2015.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read the text of this e-mail, please?
MAEGAN REES: To whom it may concern:
I hereby resign my position with Rainbow Cultural Garden as a multicultural development specialist and any other position or responsibility I may hold.
I hereby accept that I, Camila, will not and may not hold any position with Rainbow in the future and relinquish any privileges I benefit from, including relationships with children and families involved in Rainbow, monetary gain, et cetera. Any money owed to me by RCG immediately goes to Keith Raniere or any person, company of his choice.
Camila. July 22nd, 2015.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to the next exhibit, Government Exhibit 1776 -- 5, I'm sorry.
Is this from vicibaby@gmail.com sent August or sent August 9th, 2015 at 11:12 p.m.?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read the text of this e-mail, please?
MAEGAN REES: August 8th, 2015. Camila. Multicultural development specialist Rainbow Cultural Garden.
Dear Ms. Loreta Garza Davila:
I regret to inform you that I will be leaving Rainbow Cultural Garden effective immediately. Due to personal issues, I am no longer able to fulfill the responsibilities of my role and I feel it is in the best interest of the company that I vacate the position. Due to these issues, I do not consider it safe for me to be around the children under my care. From this moment on I am withdrawing myself permanently from any current relationships with the children or the families under my care and guidance. I do hope that my leaving will not cause you or Rainbow Cultural Garden any convenience.
Best, Camila.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to following exhibit, Government Exhibit 1776, an e-mail vicibaby@gmail.com dated August 10th, 2015, and the subject line is Breach of Vow.
Can you read the text under the header Breach of Vow?
MAEGAN REES: On July 2015, I, Camila, took a vow of love, loyalty and obedience with Keith A. Raniere. The following are the terms of a breach:
I, Camila, on this 8th day of August 2015, being of sound mental health and possessed of full mental capacity, hereby declare this document and all its contents and provisions to be my terms and consequences for any breach in my vow. I declare the sole executor of these terms and consequences to be Daniela Padilla, whose relationship to me is that of mentor. I authorize this execution --
THE COURT: Executor.
MAEGAN REES: Sorry.
MAEGAN REES: -- executor, upon the event of my breach of vow to manage all of my finances, accounts, properties and assets of every nature to fulfill the terms.
I hereby empower the executor to:
1. I will resign my employment as MDS at Rainbow Cultural Garden. I hereby authorize the delivery of the enclosed letter of resignation.
2. I authorize that the executor will deliver the enclosed letter addressed to Gaelyn M. Keith.
3. Claim any and all property that belongs to me, including all clothing items, two computers, one hard drive, treadmill, bike, passport, e-mail accounts.
4. Repossess of any items present and future that would sum of the total value of 1 million US dollars. This may include items belonging to me, Camila, or any future earnings, inheritance, real estate or items considered of value.
I. Camila, hereby declare this to be my true and complete terms and consequences, signed in the presence of three witnesses, and notary public listed beneath my signature.
MS. HAJJAR: And there are lines for witnesses present that are not filled out at the bottom of this e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. So turning to Government Exhibit 1777 dated August 18th, 2015, subject: Collateral Family.
And can you read just the first part of this e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Collateral Family. In case of breach of vow, I, Camila, hereby authorize the executor of all enclosed documents, Daniela Padilla, to copy-paste, the following text onto Facebook or through e-mail to family members.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, I am not going to ask you to read the portion in Spanish, but there is a line there:
Mi Papa Hector es gay, is that right, in the quoted Spanish portion?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And then there are Facebook account information, e-mail account information, which include Camila -- a redacted portion -- at@yahoo.com and vicibaby@gmail.com, which is the account from which this e-mail comes. Is that right?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Now, turning to page 285 of Government Exhibit 1779. October 1st, 2015, 9:19 p.m.
Keith Raniere: I think it would be good for you to own a fuck toy slave for me that you could groom and use as a tool to pleasure me.
MAEGAN REES: Huh? Not disagreeing, just don't understand.
MS. HAJJAR: But you're my wife. She isn't. Just a tool for you to use for me.
MAEGAN REES: A person?
MS. HAJJAR: Get a slave, you're her master.
MAEGAN REES: Hmmm, do you really want that?
MS. HAJJAR: Do you not?
MAEGAN REES: I'm not as turned on by owning.
MS. HAJJAR: Then I'll own.
MAEGAN REES: I don't know. What if you like her more than me?
MS. HAJJAR: Will never happen. That insecurity is why I suggested her being your slave.
MAEGAN REES: Okay, okay, okay, maybe I can get behind that.
MS. HAJJAR: Maybe I'll command you. Emoticon.
I need to go. Text later my dearest little fuck toy slave?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, my love.
MS. HAJJAR: Sometimes you might call me "Master" when you are being my slave.
Turn to page 304 of the same exhibit. Can you read the highlighted portion starting at 8:27 p.m.?
MAEGAN REES: Does Nicki have a slave collar.
MS. HAJJAR: Honey, I love you, but are you going to ask different people who are also slaves? Whatever I answer I feel I lose.
MAEGAN REES: I have her right next to me and it looks like she has one. That's all. And you said you took her on, so when you answer whatever I answer, I lose, I take it as you saying yes.
MS. HAJJAR: If you knew how I loved you, you would not care even if it were true.
MAEGAN REES: I am not happy, and even less happy that you deflect.
MS. HAJJAR: I am extremely saddened that you are in any way unhappy. It cuts at the root of everything for me. Calling what I am saying about process a deflection is further disturbing because it seems like you don't understand principle.
MAEGAN REES: I don't understand your answers. That you won't give me a simple yes or no answer to me says that you have something to hide. Why wouldn't you just answer? That's one.
MS. HAJJAR: So you don't understand principle. Why didn't the women in The Contender just answer that it wasn't her?
MAEGAN REES: Two is that you would suggest I get one when she already has one. The fact that this exists now makes me question everything else you have said. It just be ours, just with me.
MS. HAJJAR: Hasn't it occurred to you I have nothing to hide because I own you?
MAEGAN REES: Just as you own many others.
MS. HAJJAR: You really need to change this attitude. This is very bad.
I am turning to the page, the next page, page 305 of the same exhibit. Can you read the highlighted portion starting at 9:06 p.m.?
MAEGAN REES: I feel extremely betrayed. I feel insignificant, worthless and disposable to you. I am wondering what else have you not told me.
MS. HAJJAR: Your pride is over the top. Unless you can somehow make me believe you get it and are truly sorry, this is very bad. If you are humble, you can't be betrayed by me. Only ugly pride does that.
MAEGAN REES: I wish you were here right now. The fact that you don't give me answers hurts a lot.
MS. HAJJAR: Do you need me to continue to blame so you might break your pride?
Turning to page 312 in this exhibit, starting at October 9th, 2015, 10:18 a.m.
Keith Raniere: You need to tell me how to access it again. Also, would you accept a brand?
MAEGAN REES: What does that mean? A brand? Like a cow? Branded like cattle? I thought that's what you meant last night and that's why I brought up tattoos.
MS. HAJJAR: Using heat, creating a mark more permanent than a tattoo, I think the branding of humans preceded that of cattle.
MAEGAN REES: You want to burn me?
MS. HAJJAR: You don't want to burn for me? A good friend had a brand from his fraternity.
MAEGAN REES: I am going to burn in hell for you, but I didn't think you would want to burn me. I'll do it if you want. I don't understand your resistance towards tattoos, though.
MS. HAJJAR: Not the point. I don't want to burn you.
MAEGAN REES: I prefer tattoos, honestly, they are more defined and I like them more aesthetically.
MS. HAJJAR: This is different. You will have tattoos for other things, branding is more unique and possessive.
MAEGAN REES: I am not against it, but it is not my favorite choice.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to the next page, page 313 at the top.
Keith Raniere: I understand. I don't think you understand it. If you did, I believe you'd really want it.
Then at 12:13 p.m.
Without going into detail, it caused there to be other slaves. All who want to be branded with my monogram, plus a number. Your number is reserved. It is number one. It is now a secret growing organization. I don't know well some of the people involved, but I command them ultimately. They are not who you might think. I think there are ten or more in the current Jness track and others outside of it.
MAEGAN REES: Does that mean that they know about each other?
MS. HAJJAR: No.
MAEGAN REES: You said the main ones do to a degree. Do what? Do know about us?
MS. HAJJAR: Yes, and know you are number one.
MAEGAN REES: What? I thought no one knew.
MS. HAJJAR: No one knew which thing?
MAEGAN REES: About us.
MS. HAJJAR: You are still not telling me your thoughts or feelings.
MAEGAN REES: Who knows about us?
MS. HAJJAR: Before I tell you more, I want to know what you are thinking and feeling and that you still love me just as much.
MAEGAN REES: There is a lot I don't understand. I like uniqueness, one-of-a-kind-ness. I do love you just as much.
MS. HAJJAR: Two through seven know you are one.
MAEGAN REES: I'm okay with you having other slaves. I assume that these are not sexual.
MS. HAJJAR: They may or may not be. They would be if I commanded, but that is not the reason for the organization.
MAEGAN REES: I would like to be the one that knows your body.
MS. HAJJAR: It is an absolutely trusted commitment.
MAEGAN REES: I want to be the one that worships your body.
MS. HAJJAR: Many will not even know of my existence. Some don't already.
MAEGAN REES: Also, although I vowed servitude and I get great pleasure from serving you, I always imagined us being a partnership. You know, us against the world.
MS. HAJJAR: Yes. Still possible, but know there are others I trust. I had to, or else I would have had to send you to a psych ward in Mexico... Now.
MAEGAN REES: I don't get that.
MS. HAJJAR: I can explain sometime, but in the USA attempting suicide can lead to murder charges if you succeed in the future. There are also some ethical issues that are very difficult.
Agent Rees, are there other references in the WhatsApp chats you reviewed about going to Mexico or being back in Mexico?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: December 1st, 2015 at 5:11 p.m.
Keith Raniere: You may want to understand how much I support you and this community, so you can not be entitled. If I had died and you went back -- you would have been back in Mexico in less than a year.
And this is out Government Exhibit 1779 on page 587.
Can you read the next excerpt?
MAEGAN REES: April 27th, 2015, 12:05 p.m.: My dream was to do something to help change the way we educate children. If I'm not good there and have nothing to contribute, then I will step down. Please don't send me back to Mexico.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to page 320 of the same exhibit, October 10th, 2015, 1:43 p.m.
Keith Raniere: Find a life slave and I will tell you everything.
MAEGAN REES: What do you mean by life slave?
MS. HAJJAR: Someone who has a collateralized vow with you for life.
(Continuing on the following page.)
(Continuing)
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to page 127.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read the highlighted portion?
MAEGAN REES: October 11th, 2015, 7:48 p.m.
I am yours. I will brand, pierce, tattoo, freeze, cut my body if it helps.
MS. HAJJAR: Do all the things I mentioned intensely. Think of things to do even more. Think of things to please me.
MAEGAN REES: I wrote them down. I am on it.
MS. HAJJAR: And then turning to the next page 338 the same Exhibit.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read the highlighted portions starting from the top?
MAEGAN REES: October 13th, 2015, 9:46 p.m.
Ha ha. Oh, man, I am so curious.
MS. HAJJAR: About what?
MAEGAN REES: Your slaves. Their identities and level.
MS. HAJJAR: Well, apart from you, there are six first line. Not Pam, Monkey, Karen, Dawn, Lauren, Nancy, Rebecca and many others you might suspect. The front line forms a group that are all devoted to each other and me?
MS. HAJJAR: Then at 10:00 p.m. the same page.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: What are your thoughts? Feelings? All of them have slaves in process. Some have several completed.
MAEGAN REES: I feel insecure but at the same time I feel proud of you. You are worthy of a following like that.
MS. HAJJAR: So are you. You're number one.
MAEGAN REES: I would be proud to stand next to you.
MS. HAJJAR: Even naked with six other committed naked women?
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to page 343 of the same Exhibit.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read from the top, please?
MAEGAN REES: October 14th, 2015, 3:38 p.m.
JUROR: These three monitors went out.
THE COURT: The monitors blocked out?
Let's take a brief recess and bring in the IT people to take a look at the monitors.
All rise for the jury.
COURT CLERK: All rise.
(Jury exits.)
(In open court; outside the presence of the jury.)
THE COURT: You may stand down, we will take a brief recess.
(Witness steps down.)
THE COURT: All right, we will take five minutes.
(Recess taken.) (In open court.)
(Judge NICHOLAS G. GARAUFIS enters the courtroom.)
COURT CLERK: All rise.
THE COURT: Let's bring in the witness, please.
(Witness resumes stand.)
THE COURT: About how much more do you have?
MS. HAJJAR: Your Honor, it may go slightly into tomorrow morning, I have enough in the direct examination to last to the end of the day.
THE COURT: Well, it is what it is.
MR. AGNIFILO: I don't think the cross tomorrow will be too long.
THE COURT: Okay.
MS. PENZA: Your Honor, we were trying to, as the day -- take each day, days where we think that it may be appropriate to go a little longer. We wanted to raise it with the Court because we know there had been contemplation of whether we could go long on certain days.
I think tomorrow, given that there will be a number of witnesses, I think that it would be a day where we could go an additional hour.
THE COURT: Go an additional hour?
MS. PENZA: Yes, if the Court and the jury --
THE COURT: With the jury? I will check. I will check if the jury can go -- you are saying until 6:00?
MS. PENZA: Yes, Your Honor, or 5:30, Your Honor. Whatever the Court wishes.
THE COURT: Let me see if I can work out 5:30 as a possibility.
MS. PENZA: Thank you, Your Honor.
THE COURT: In an effort to move the trial along, in that context it might be possible to do that.
MS. PENZA: Okay, otherwise...
THE COURT: It will be what it is.
MS. PENZA: Understood. Thank you, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Let's bring in the jury.
(Jury enters.)
MAEGAN REES: Yes, Your Honor.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: I'm directing you to page 343 of Government's Exhibit 1779.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you please read the highlighted portion starting from the top?
MAEGAN REES: October 14th, 2015. 3:38 p.m.
How much can I share with Allison? She's asking about our relationship. I think I'm going to throw up or faint. Can I text Berta? I still feel like I want to throw up. There is much I don't know and understand. The children thing breaks my heart more than I ever thought possible. I wanted a life with you. I wanted my purity and devotion and your love and beauty to create beautiful children to inhabit the world. It feels like death. I feel like I'm going to break. Allison called the slave thing like sister-wives and I don't know if that -- I don't know if that it what it is or what you want it to be. I'm also struggling with the fact that I've paid my dues. I also owe --
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to the next page at the top, it's a continuation.
MAEGAN REES: -- because of what I did. For ten years, and they are just coming in, and at least Allison assumes she is the same as me and we are all the same.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you continue reading the two messages that follow.
MAEGAN REES: I'm sorry, the?
MS. HAJJAR: The messages that follow.
MAEGAN REES: In blue?
MS. HAJJAR: They're not highlighted but can you read them.
MAEGAN REES: I'm sorry.
That bothered me. She has no clue. She is fresh and excited because she just came in. I don't think it is right to level that to ten years of our life together.
MS. HAJJAR: Please heal this. Both paths are different and can't be compared. A restarted broken path of ten years is not comparable to a new path.
MAEGAN REES: What do you mean? What specifically are you referring to when you say heal this?
MS. HAJJAR: I just threw up blood for 15 minutes. I want my sweet love loving happy Cami back.
MAEGAN REES: By the way, what do the numbers mean? She knew her number. Do they all know their number? I need to sit. I feel like I'm going to throw up. I thought I'd stand next to you as number one. I thought I'd be your partner and I was even thinking of ways of helping them feel special and included.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to the next page, 345, the same Exhibit.
MS. HAJJAR: At the top, can you read the highlighted portion.
MAEGAN REES: Can it still be our home with our kids and our love? I'll give my arm for it.
MS. HAJJAR: Yes. But you need to find slaves quickly that are good.
MAEGAN REES: Are these slaves for you? Or for us?
MS. HAJJAR: There are two types. Both types are for us. One type is in the program. You are their master, I am their Grandmaster. The other type are very select ones you use to heal us, likely being also of the first type.
MAEGAN REES: Okay. I am asking because these persons will be in our life forever but I was not involved in the process of choosing who.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, can you continue reading, even though it is not highlighted, below that?
MAEGAN REES: I am afraid I will not be comfortable with the others.
MS. HAJJAR: You choose your slaves.
MAEGAN REES: What about the seven? Allison said these seven were forever. She and others will be forever in my life.
MS. HAJJAR: They are first to me, first line to me but if any suit the purpose, I obviously have access.
MAEGAN REES: But I did not pick them. Yeah, but what if I don't want one of the seven forever in my life?
MS. HAJJAR: The circumstance will need to evolve. It should be that way if you're devoted and love me. That they have committed should give them respect and care from you also, as well as the other way around.
MAEGAN REES: But you didn't ask. You have stuck me with seven women for life and didn't ask. I'm afraid Nicky will be part of it. I would never pick Nicky or Monica.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you continue reading, Agent Rees, straight through.
MAEGAN REES: I would pick someone like Melissa. Or Pam. Or Marisa. I feel like I'm drowning.
MS. HAJJAR: Marisa who?
MAEGAN REES: Jness from Monterrey. I feel like I'm going to be sick. The way it was presented and the way it actually is, is very different. I am struggling. I am holding onto your love. I haven't stopped shaking. I want to hold you and for you to hold me.
MS. HAJJAR: It feels worse than that because of how you're experiencing this. I am truly heartbroken at the deepest level. I would hope you would eagerly embrace everyone I might choose, in part, because you know, I choose by virtue. Even if I chose a female Hitler.
MAEGAN REES: Media omitted.
I feel like you are rejecting me all again. I should have kept things to myself.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, can you continue reading the portion in between the highlighted portions?
MAEGAN REES: No. No. No, no. No rejection. If anything, I'm holding onto you. This is just not what I thought. I really thought it would take away from us but all the time you spend with them you choose not to spend with me. It hurts. Did you like female Hitler?
MS. HAJJAR: It won't at all if you embrace it without reservation. This is what a good slave would do.
MAEGAN REES: I want to be good for you. I wanted to be good enough to be your wife. Good enough to be wanted.
MS. HAJJAR: And just continue reading.
Considering what I've endured over the past year plus, doesn't that demonstrate anything to you?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, my honey, it really does. I'm just sharing how it feels. I know you love me. Honey, please tell me you didn't pick Nicky or Monica. You know I've always had issues with them. Also, when you mention the slaves, I thought you were putting me as number one meant something. At today I feel like I was downgraded. I'm just struggling, that's all. It was a lot at once, give me time. I feel like my identity was blended in with the others. I'm just sharing feelings, not making accusations. I love you. I'm mourning the loss of you and me against the world. I'd give anything to have that back. You and me against the world. That was special.
MS. HAJJAR: It could be. But after tonight I feel disheartened. Instead of joyfully accepting everything I do and have done, you're not. How can it be you and me against the world if that's true?
MAEGAN REES: No, my sweetheart, I am accepting. I am just scared shitless. I am so sorry. I'm not rejecting it or you.
MS. HAJJAR: The thing you would have to give up is all your negative pride and love me enough to be fearless.
MS. HAJJAR: I am going to turn to the next page.
MS. HAJJAR: October 15th, 2015, at 12:51 p.m. Read the highlighted portion.
MAEGAN REES: Do you have any tips for me? I want to be the best.
MS. HAJJAR: Unfortunately, the most intense stimulation requires two or three mouths. But as a single mouth, you're fantastic.
MAEGAN REES: Okay. I need to warm up to the idea of two to three mouths, but if that were the case, could I be the one to drink you?
MS. HAJJAR: Absolutely. That's what those fuck toys are for.
MAEGAN REES: Oh, goody. Honey, can I tell you something?
MS. HAJJAR: Yes.
MAEGAN REES: I feel like I'm in a competition now, like I have to defend whatever I have left. I feel like I got a lot taken away from me yesterday.
MS. HAJJAR: Not true.
MAEGAN REES: I believe you, I'm just sharing how I feel.
MS. HAJJAR: But your needing to defend could be transformed into positive motivation.
MAEGAN REES: I thought we were still going to have a family. Gone. I thought I was the only one. Gone. Yeah, I am using it to be better, but it is not nice to feel like they are going to steal everything from you at any moment. I was excited about the slaves because they would understand the specialness of us and help protect it. I discovered the opposite yesterday.
MS. HAJJAR: All right, I'm turning to page 360 on October 17th, 2015, at 3:07 p.m.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: Which slaves? The general ones or our more personal ones?
MS. HAJJAR: At 3:11 p.m.
MS. HAJJAR: The more personal ones allow you to stimulate my body so it can grow stronger faster. Multiple slaves allow you to never be worn. Also can do things to make me come more than you. Also, the multiple pheromones of a highly-stimulated biochemical effect by preventing habituation.
MAEGAN REES: Oh, I meant the six. You are talking about the slaves I will get, right?
MS. HAJJAR: The six can help me move the world because I'm not strong enough now to push with the other vehicles I've created. They can also be absolutely trusted and will not fight me no matter what. I have always done things democratically but there is not time.
MAEGAN REES: Ah, okay.
MS. HAJJAR: Yes to your question.
MAEGAN REES: I may ask for help in finding a successor and slaves. My methods are not getting me anywhere. Any suggestions on who I could ask?
MS. HAJJAR: Dani or Rosalara.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to page 366 of the same Exhibit.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read starting from the top.
MAEGAN REES: October 18th, 2015, 3:10 p.m.
I think Dani just accidentally revealed two other slaves.
MS. HAJJAR: Who?
MAEGAN REES: Nicky and Monica.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to the next page, 367.
MAEGAN REES: 4:02 p.m.
I know you said the slaves were to move the world because you didn't have the strength. Did you get them also to have children? Just so you know, it stings, but it doesn't affect my love or commitment to you.
MS. HAJJAR: No, I don't need slaves to have as many children as I would want.
MAEGAN REES: What does that mean?
MS. HAJJAR: I won't be able to respond on the road. I do not need to have slaves. There are many women who would have my children.
MAEGAN REES: I know.
MS. HAJJAR: I can probably name 20 or more. Slaves aren't needed for that.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to page 391, October 23rd, 2015 at 5:37 a.m.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: Honey I need to go, some of these sound like they may be good prospects. What do they think of me?
MAEGAN REES: They admire you. Idolize you. I don't know sexually. They might not have even considered it because of your position, but I'm sure they think you are hot.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to the following page 392, October 23rd, 2015 at 5:46 a.m..
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: What if you suggested they seduce someone (me) with you?
MAEGAN REES: Ooh. Like a game?
MS. HAJJAR: Don't tell them it's me. Just see if they're open. Or truth or dare.
MAEGAN REES: Okay, okay. Okay. I like all these ideas. Let me see how I can make them real. I'll think about it.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to page 399, the same Exhibit, October 25th, 2015, 2:00 a.m.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: There are potential successors but they are so young. This creates several problems. Will I live long enough? Will they stay pure? Will they connect so deeply with me being so much older? Will I have the strength to put in the years once connected? Even if all that works, will any be viable? If so, will they remain true?
MAEGAN REES: How can I increase your chances of success?
MS. HAJJAR: Maybe working with them.
MAEGAN REES: Anything, my love.
MS. HAJJAR: It's sad. Isabella was possible when I had you start looking.
MAEGAN REES: Are there any more like her?
MS. HAJJAR: She's older and could have started much sooner. One but she's very unlikely.
MAEGAN REES: Because of age?
MS. HAJJAR: No, personality and energy.
MAEGAN REES: Fabiola's daughter?
MS. HAJJAR: She's a potential but might not be pure for long. Norma.
MAEGAN REES: She is?
MS. HAJJAR: Norma is pure.
MAEGAN REES: What's the problem with her energy?
MS. HAJJAR: Not sure if it's terminal. I'll see. She's mine.
MAEGAN REES: ? What do you mean?
MS. HAJJAR: She doesn't know. She doesn't know that I am her Grandmaster.
MS. HAJJAR: And then turning to 2:13 a.m.
MAEGAN REES: Please tell me there is something I can do to be your successor. Please.
MS. HAJJAR: And then at 2:16 a.m.
Keith Raniere: The other candidates so far are all 13 or so. So many years to wait even to start. That last text was not the answer to your question. I have always protected you and made things better behind the scenes. I can keep you at your current purity level but I can't restore what was lost.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to page 401, October 25th, 2015. 2:25 a.m.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: I want you to be my successor.
MAEGAN REES: Please let me be your successor. I don't know who to consult. I want to find a way to be your successor.
MS. HAJJAR: You would have to do all this and find a path. I don't know if one exists except I know I need a pure vessel involved. We can have our love, but purity, both energy-related and DNA-wise, is compromised.
MAEGAN REES: No.
MS. HAJJAR: No?
MAEGAN REES: I will fix it.
MS. HAJJAR: I want that. Find a pure vessel for us.
MAEGAN REES: I want to be your vessel.
MS. HAJJAR: Then page 419, October 27th, 2015, 1:47 a.m.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: You can. By finding the other and keeping her for me.
MAEGAN REES: I am looking for her. I am very sorry.
MS. HAJJAR: She needs to be very pure. More than being just a virgin. At least as pure as you were when I first met you.
MAEGAN REES: What do you mean more than just a virgin? How?
MS. HAJJAR: No oral sex. No semen. Ideally, no penis at all.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to page 485. November 8th, 2015, 1:41 p.m.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: Honey, I may not have other children.
MAEGAN REES: My womb is yours.
MS. HAJJAR: I may not be worthy. My lineage may not stay.
MAEGAN REES: What can I do?
MS. HAJJAR: Fix. Successor. Slaves. Even more quickly.
MS. HAJJAR: And at 2:44 p.m. on the same page.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: As of now I have not been worthy to do what I do, be as I am and have a pure woman stay devoted to me. As of now I have no successor. This means my teachings will not last as anything in their own right and will be absorbed into other things, which also means the genetic advantages I possess are not worthy and will go away, which means there will be strong forces for me not to have many children. If my lineage does not withstand competition, my unique genetic combo will not be able to either. It will not be a basis of other generations. It will be absorbed and combined with others until a superior combination comes about.
MS. HAJJAR: Then turning to page 509, can you.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read the highlighted portion.
MAEGAN REES: November 13th, 2015, 12:23 p.m.
Projects for the slaves. I don't understand how the slaves play into it.
MS. HAJJAR: Yes. Projects scene is yours that you created by bringing in these people. You create value with new people. That earns my time.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to page 534, November 18th, 2015, 1:47 p.m.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: Maybe Rosalara can assist. How many candidates do you have? How are they with you?
MAEGAN REES: They are super-nice to me and look up to me in a way.
MS. HAJJAR: Any of them pure enough or just slave?
MAEGAN REES: Just slave.
MS. HAJJAR: How do you feel about being friends with young future candidates and shepherding them over time?
JUROR: Excuse me, the screens. The screens they went out.
THE COURT: They are out again?
JUROR: This is working, that one works. These three are out.
And mine.
Four.
(Pause in the proceedings.)
THE COURT: It will be just a moment.
(Pause in the proceedings.)
THE COURT: While we are waiting.
Members of the Jury, I don't know if Mr. Reccoppa mentioned it to you, that we might want to go a little later than 5:00 o'clock on several days so that we can move the trial along, but discuss it among yourselves and if there are days that are better than others, tomorrow and possibly next week, let us know if you can accommodate us with going until perhaps 5:30 instead of 5:00 o'clock. Anything you can do will help us all to move the case along, but I think you should consider that and discuss among yourselves. Let Mr. Reccoppa know if you are able to make some adjustment, all right?
JURORS: Yes.
(Pause in the proceedings.)
JURORS: They're good.
THE COURT: They're on again? Why don't you just stay right there.
COURT STAFF: Yes, Your Honor.
THE COURT: All right, let's continue then, thank you.
MS. HAJJAR: All right, Agent Rees, starting 1:47 p.m.
Keith Raniere: Maybe Rosalara can assist. How many candidates to you have --
MS. HAJJAR: I'm sorry, we went through this already. We'll skip to the next page.
Turning to 539, same Exhibit, at the top.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read from the top highlighted portion.
MAEGAN REES: November 19th, 2015, 12:14 p.m.
I'm trying to think of someone who would be a good support but no one around here is a good candidate. I think I'll go online.
MS. HAJJAR: Please don't go online.
MAEGAN REES: Then?
MS. HAJJAR: How about Laureis?
MAEGAN REES: No.
MS. HAJJAR: Why?
MAEGAN REES: I am secretly hurt that for years you said you would help me get through this and now you are abandoning me. I feel unloved and misunderstood.
MS. HAJJAR: Look at the pride in the message for the last. You are being prideful and self-centered. I almost died last night, felt worse life-force-wise than I have in my life. You are worried about you and somehow, which is what you did to betray me, making it I rejected you. This really changes my hopes with you. I can't trust you.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to page 599. December 3rd, 2015, 10:37 p.m.
MS. HAJJAR: Keith Raniere: Three of the four candidates are so young in many ways. It will take years until they mature and then I will be even older and weaker. Doubtful I will be much of a candidate for them.
MAEGAN REES: You would be, honey. Any of those girls would be lucky to have you.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to page 608. December 5th, 2015.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read at the top, please.
MAEGAN REES: 6:40 p.m. I'm waiting out the lesbians. How are your meetings, love?
(Continued on following page.)
DIRECT EXAMINATION (Continuing) BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Lesbians can be turned to the dark side, especially if they are slaves.
And, Agent Rees, I'm going to ask you to read the non-highlighted portion between these two segments.
MAEGAN REES: To the dark side. Ha, ha. They tend to be arrogant or stubborn. That's the only problem.
MS. HAJJAR: As slaves, pride can be broken, arrogance thereby removed.
Page 649, can you read at the top, at the highlighted portion?
MAEGAN REES: December 20, 2015, 3:16 p.m.:
I heard back from three of the candidates. Does that help?
MS. HAJJAR: I wish the cure could move much faster, but it can only go so fast. I wish things could move faster with you, but you're only capable of so much.
And then, turning to Government Exhibit 310-R, is this another e-mail Camilla to Camilla, August 6, 2016, attaching a WhatsApp chat with an unknown caller?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to page 417 of this exhibit, October 26, 2015, at 1:29 p.m.:
The few lineage in the world -- lineages in the world are set up on a type of evolutionary basis, survival of the fittest. There are no remedies if you're not the fittest. If my existence is not worthy, no healer can fix that. Survival of the fittest doesn't work if the participants can be fixed. The best hope is someone pure, qualified and devoted.
MAEGAN REES: Emoticon.
MS. HAJJAR: I don't know if I'm even strong enough anymore to build that energy. Once R destroyed that in you, I was greatly limited and not as strong. It would take great strength for me to build that again over years.
MAEGAN REES: But you said I could help you. It is very painful, but I am willing to help you replace me.
MS. HAJJAR: Yes. But I don't know if enough of anything can reverse the extinction of my lineage. If anyone can help, it's you. But I wish there were a guarantee.
MAEGAN REES: What kind of guarantee do you need?
MS. HAJJAR: It's not what I need, I just don't know of any definite way to avoid what is happening.
MAEGAN REES: What can I do? What do you need from me?
MS. HAJJAR: For example, even if the perfect pure successor felt deeply enough for me to start today, I don't know if I have the energy to put in for the next three to five years to build her body to where yours was.
MAEGAN REES: Emoticon. Hurts.
MS. HAJJAR: Three to five years is minimum. More like ten. When the thing with R happened, so much was lost.
MAEGAN REES: I am very sorry.
MS. HAJJAR: You were so perfect. It's so hard.
Turning to page 419, can you read from the top, please?
MAEGAN REES: October 26, 2015, 8:27 p.m.:
Hi, my honey. I forgot that you might not reply that much. I have been searching for candidates for a successor on the site. It is called experienceproject.com and it connects people based on explicitly listed common values and experiences. My profile is carefully crafted by someone with a personality that you might be looking for and a virgin, of course. I can show you, if you want, so you can add or remove anything you feel would help. I have messaged a few women, but I haven't heard back. I also wanted to see if I can find out if Chelsea has friends that might be like her, if it is a thing or if her losing her V card so late was a fluke.
MS. HAJJAR: Has to be hard. Apparently Chelsea has a younger sister, 14, but that's years away and her family would take it hard.
And turning to page 446 of 310-R, November 1, 2015, 4:13 p.m., Keith Raniere:
I don't know if I can give any other potential successor the quantity or quality of life force I gave to you to build you. I feel like it is climbing Mount Everest again. Even if I started now, it's years and years, even if I were strong and motivated. Now it is from pain, not positivism.
MAEGAN REES: What can I do? Can I reclaim my position? I'll do anything.
MS. HAJJAR: I don't know. Keep pushing and more fully understand what was lost.
MAEGAN REES: I will, honey.
MS. HAJJAR: I was amazed how your body would pull the energy out of me. It would seem like it searched every corner out of my body and pulled every last bit. Each encounter was so amazing.
MAEGAN REES: Is it not anymore? Is that what you want the new successor to do? How are you feeling?
MS. HAJJAR: No texts. I just heard your father is now concerned about where you live. We need to be very careful, Fluffy or others might try to follow you.
Page 447, the top, November 1, 2015, 6:18 p.m.:
Too much to text what was lost, how perfect it was in so many ways, what it means to not find a successor and almost just as bad to find one.
MAEGAN REES: Oh, then we are paining over the same thing. I thought you said there was a way I could still be it. Did you change your mind?
MS. HAJJAR: There has to be a pure element. I have to take her and build her for that. For you, I don't think I have the capacity. I gave it completely and fully to you.
MAEGAN REES: I wish the movies and stories were right. It is a lie that love conquers all. It doesn't. It doesn't matter how much we love each other. You will still replace me. I could have left. I hope the fact that I chose you and will rebuild our love with every breath would mean something, would probably make us stronger.
MS. HAJJAR: No. You replaced me no matter how much I loved.
MAEGAN REES: November 1, 2015, 6:45 p.m.:
I don't feel strong today. I feel very insecure. I feel like I have nothing to offer. I feel worthless. We never had much content to share except me healing you and being pure. So now I have no loyalty or purity to offer, so I don't think you would want to be with me. I don't know what I have to offer.
MS. HAJJAR: After all I've done, you realize that's insulting.
MAEGAN REES: I am sorry. I am just expressing. I don't mean to insult you. I'm not talking about reality. I'm talking about how I feel. It has more do with what I have done than with you.
MS. HAJJAR: Then page 452, November 2, 2015, 5:38 p.m.
Can you read the highlighted portion?
MAEGAN REES: Transcript. Still looking for successors out there, thought more of slaves. I will plan a trip to New York City before Thanksgiving and visit all my candidates.
What do you think? Can I text Janie?
MS. HAJJAR: Why are the candidates in New York City?
MAEGAN REES: Why are they there? That's where they live right now.
MS. HAJJAR: All?
MAEGAN REES: Yes. All my current candidates, yes.
MS. HAJJAR: Any reason why or just statistics?
MAEGAN REES: Just statistics. I'm open to any location, but this is what I found for now.
MS. HAJJAR: Be careful it's not a trap. If you have only texted, you don't know who's on the other end.
MAEGAN REES: Question.
MS. HAJJAR: Question mark.
MAEGAN REES: I'm talking about Narina, Marianna, Elizabeth, they are all lesbians.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. I thought you had found possible online candidates also.
MAEGAN REES: I'm still looking. I am finding ways.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to page 464, can you read the highlighted portion at the top?
MAEGAN REES: November 3, 2015, 3:59 p.m.
I wish you didn't. I wish you could recognize the pain that I feel now and was not willing to feel during the year is all the difference. The fact that I want to be with you, even though I know I'll never get the family I've always wanted, I would have liked for you to see that and know that you are more important to me, that I choose you over everything, I've always thought would make me happy. I would hope you can see that it means something that I chose a life of despair for you. I went to the bathroom. I wish you'd recognized that I could have walked away, but I chose to stay. I walked away many, many times during the year. I finally chose to stay, chose you. I wish you could see that.
MS. HAJJAR: I understand. Do you understand my doubt if R or Jim or someone else presents an opportunity I'm not sure of the outcome?
MAEGAN REES: No. I don't think you know the pain I feel.
MS. HAJJAR: You tried to commit suicide, still hadn't chose me, but you would've had to go to a psych ward in Mexico. So it was a choice between staying or that, not me.
MAEGAN REES: Not true. I really considered that option. I was not against it. What I didn't want was never speaking to you again.
MS. HAJJAR: Please don't take this wrong. It's not negative just expressing the pain I feel each time I want to believe the things you say. I won't be able to fully for a long time.
MAEGAN REES: You do know why I tried to kill myself, right?
MS. HAJJAR: Why?
MAEGAN REES: You said you are dead to me.
MS. HAJJAR: Yes, but even after that whole thing you didn't choose me.
MAEGAN REES: I'm not going to get through. Okay.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to page 494, November 8, 2015, 5:17 p.m.
That night was the biggest shift of consciousness, that's why you were in a trance-like state. That's the thing that is hardest to get back.
MAEGAN REES: How could I get it back?
MS. HAJJAR: I don't know if it's possible now, but it needs another pure vessel that I prepare and that doesn't fail. I don't know if I have it in me to repair another. With that pure vessel, we might be if able to have it.
MAEGAN REES: Okay. I'm looking, love.
MS. HAJJAR: I'm running out of time and the potential ones are so young, it would take a rare one indeed to transcend social norms and relate with someone so much older that way permanently. Besides I'm a donkey, that really gets in the way.
And turning to page 529, 3:36 p.m.:
It will hurt me physically and set me back if I am intimate with you in the next two to three days because of B. My condition is very tenuous. It will also hurt me physically and set me back to not be intimate with you in the next two to three days. You would have had the capacity help me. I don't know which pain I should take or can bear.
MAEGAN REES: This is new information for me. You know that I am bulimic, right? This is every day and has been for years, but now today, you make it -- you have to make this choice. Something doesn't make sense here.
MS. HAJJAR: I feel you haven't been listening to me then.
MAEGAN REES: Oh, shit. I'm sorry. I might be too caught up in my panic. Okay, let me try again.
MS. HAJJAR: When was the last time you B before last night?
MAEGAN REES: Yesterday evening.
MS. HAJJAR: I told you B is bad for me and us, but the weight is worse. I also thought you got that. If you stop the B, without my having to ask, it was much better because of some R things. The other day was going to ask you to stop, but because it was better I didn't, you stopped me and said, in effect, you had it covered. I have been in need the past few weeks. I'm very critical now. You have ignored all of this it seems and continue to be.
MAEGAN REES: Yes, I have been trying and thought I could do it alone, but I am struggling. I'm very sorry, honey.
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to page 4, at 5:46, can you read the chat starting at the top, please?
MAEGAN REES: November 19, 2015, 3:24 p.m.:
I feel it. I know. You don't want to hear it, but I am sorry. I think I keep trying ways to get you to help me because I feel like I can't do it on my own. I feel hurt. But I think whenever I feel hurt, it is pride. If I drop it, I just start crying because I'm afraid I will fail again and you just will be upset again. I feel scared and alone and I feel blammie [sic] because you were supposed to hold my hand in this life. So I take this as my punishment for letting go of your hand once.
MS. HAJJAR: I told you I would help. I offered something, you refused and want to do it your way.
MAEGAN REES: I feel punished. I know I am not but I feel punished. I feel scared. I feel lost. I feel alone. Very alone.
MS. HAJJAR: It is childish to think in terms of punishment instead of cause and effect.
MAEGAN REES: And because you are not here, in this battle, I feel like you don't want to be here. You don't want me. You don't love me. I am unloved.
MS. HAJJAR: If you were humble and went over your past texts, it would help.
MAEGAN REES: I'm not trying to be logical or mature. I am baring my soul. I am telling you what's underneath when I drop the pride.
MS. HAJJAR: I am helping you. I'm showing you how to make it better.
MAEGAN REES: I tried rejecting the pride, but even that you wouldn't be with me for. I felt angry because I felt so scared. I have a lot of very scary feelings -- that I didn't know still existed -- come up. And I first pushed them down because I didn't know how to handle them. So how am I supposed to handle them now? I feel abandoned and that is very scary. I don't want other people. I want you. I wanted support, encouragement, love and acceptance and I've gotten only criticism. I feel very shake [sic]. Very unstable. I wanted to feel safe in this process and I don't. I know it's not your fault. I just want to feel safe. I think that is why I choose pride because I feel so unsafe. I keep reaching out for the one constant in my life, the love in my life, and I keep getting rejected. That is super scary. I don't have bulimia as my coping mechanism anymore, so it's even scarier. I don't want to fail you. I am so scared.
MS. HAJJAR: And then, turning to page 632, can you read the highlighted portions please?
MAEGAN REES: December 11, 2015, 11:41:
Hi, honey. I am at this moment creating another profile to create more candidate options. I don't know if it is the profile I have now, or what, but I'm not getting a lot of responses. I've been thinking of a few things, honey, between slaves, successors, you raising a child with another woman, me being okay with it because it is bigger than me, time, your strength, collateral.
December 12, 2015, 1:04 a.m.:
I am sorry. I don't know why tonight is a painful night. I don't want to make it harder on you. I want to give you strength, help us grow, but it is a night of despair. Love you very much. I am working on building a strong profile to create options for candidates, slaves. I'm looking for them to be in New York State, looking for meaning or a better life, unconventional maybe, introspective. Any suggestions?
MS. HAJJAR: And turning to page 670, can you read the highlighted portion at the top.
MAEGAN REES: December 25, 2015, 9:52 p.m.:
I am sad that we will be apart for the 28th and New Year's.
MS. HAJJAR: Why not showering?
MAEGAN REES: Because I shower for you. I just came home. I feel better when I am home. I feel closer to you. I feel safe here like I am in your arms.
MS. HAJJAR: The shower thing is hard because that first summer you showered for R and many people noticed, and haven't for me.
MAEGAN REES: Oh, my God, you are right. I will fix that. I had forgotten about that. It is true.
MS. HAJJAR: Is it the transcript? Tell me what you did and why.
MAEGAN REES: It is not in the transcript. It is not something I did with him or he ever mentioned or asked me to do.
MS. HAJJAR: Ideally, everyone needs to see you as better, healthier, prettier, cleaner, happier than you've ever been. The stuff for R needs to be disaffirmed, but you did it around or for him, noticeable by him and others. It is important.
MAEGAN REES: I understand. I'm not saying that it's not.
MS. HAJJAR: I know. I just want to know about it and telling you such things should be in the transcript with the motivation behind them. I don't feel peaceful with today, your lack of texting and other things has me very sad and uneasy.
MAEGAN REES: The why is, when I was after his attention, I was going for careless and was in a way choosing a life of image. Right now, I feel like all of that is meaningless. I feel like why does it matter to look good, why put on the makeup, the hair. Why? What did I do? I feel like when I chose you, I chose a way from the life, from the looks, et cetera. I just feel like what's the point.
MS. HAJJAR: But you need to show your desire and are willing to do more for me in every way.
MAEGAN REES: Oh, honey, I'm sorry for the misunderstanding. I'm not unwilling to do for you. Quite the opposite.
MS. HAJJAR: Do you really want to have treated him with more care than you treat me?
MAEGAN REES: I am just becoming aware of these feelings. No. I wish we could Skype.
MS. HAJJAR: And do you want others to think you are better because of him?
MAEGAN REES: No. You know that, honey.
MS. HAJJAR: How do you show all those people you are better now than then? Materialistic, image-conscious people like your brother and sister.
Can you start -- this is on 12/26/15, 12:30 a.m., can you read from the top, please?
MAEGAN REES: I didn't do it for him. I felt alive. I felt like I wanted to go out and do stuff, develop skills, grow, move forward, go to life with friends, family, social life. I wanted was the main part. I felt driven to not stay locked in watching my life go by. I felt an urgency to live because I wouldn't get my twenties again. That's why I looked better to people. That's why I went out more, attended social events, parties, went out, et cetera.
MS. HAJJAR: So how can you outdo that for me and also break the association to him?
MAEGAN REES: I don't want to do that with you because it takes away from our time, because that is what you do when you still have hope and believe life is beautiful. I feel shame all the time and feel like no matter what I do, one, it can't be about me or for me; two, it doesn't change what I can't get back. Nothing I do will bring back our future lost. I feel hopeless. I feel like I only live for you. I feel like I should only live for you. I feel like my life is not mine in that way. I can't do as I please. I will do those things, though, to fix those associations. I don't want to leave it like that. This is why I wanted to Skype. When I read it back, it sounds very whiny and suffery [sic]. It's not meant that way, but it does carry pain. I want to be able to share these feelings without feeling like I just said something bad.
MS. HAJJAR: When you say I can't do as I please, it hurts deeply. I want you to understand.
MAEGAN REES: Why? It is true. It is wrongful, wouldn't you agree? For two reasons.
MS. HAJJAR: What two reasons? It might be true, but if you love me, it would be true -- wouldn't be true.
MAEGAN REES: One, for anyone to do as they please is inconsiderate of others and very damaging to anyone around them. Two, when I broke the window, I kind up gave up the right to do what I want with my life. Until it is repaired, I think I don't have the same freedom as if I didn't have a pending bill. Is this incorrect?
MS. HAJJAR: If you loved me, you would want to do anything else.
MAEGAN REES: I'm not sure I understand.
MS. HAJJAR: When one loves they automatically consider others, it would never be any other way. The greatest joy is to consider others.
I'm turning to the next page, 672. Can you continue reading?
MAEGAN REES: That's why I wanted to Skype. I feel like you are taking this as a complaint. I'm not complaining. If you look at the text, it starts with: I don't want to do that with you.
MS. HAJJAR: No, the assumptions under what you're saying really hurt. That you don't have hope or don't believe life is beautiful is the most disastrous thing you could say.
MAEGAN REES: Would you be open to considering that maybe that is not what I am saying? Or assuming? Because I just want you. I chose you and I don't want anyone else or do anything else. Please don't say that.
MS. HAJJAR: Look at the out of cause assumptions under what you texted.
Page 673, December 26, 2015, 12:49 a.m., Keith Raniere:
Feeling cheated is out of cause and not only your participation. I can't even open it on the computer yet.
MAEGAN REES: This was not something to do over text. This is too deep a wound for me. It should not have been open like this.
MS. HAJJAR: What's the wound? All out of causedness [sic] needs to be removed. You should feel no wounds other than the desire to fix and make right and love, no suffering whatsoever.
MAEGAN REES: Skype.
(Continued on following page.)
EXAMINATION CONTINUES BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Suffering here disrespects the damage you've caused in love. Can't.
MAEGAN REES: I can't do this over text.
MS. HAJJAR: Then turning to 679, December 27th, 2015, 4:46 p.m.
Can you read the highlighted portion?
MAEGAN REES: Why are you not feeling well, love?
MS. HAJJAR: Slowly but surely I'm wearing down. It's a combination of no successor, this new life, and other things.
MAEGAN REES: This new life?
MS. HAJJAR: Not what is, was going to be. New is not good in this case.
MAEGAN REES: Oh, you mean all the new women you have taken on?
MS. HAJJAR: No.
MAEGAN REES: Why can't we move it to what it was going to be?
MS. HAJJAR: Not having the life with you. I had really put all my eggs in that basket, so to speak.
MAEGAN REES: Am I doing something wrong?
MS. HAJJAR: Can -- I think that's your --
MAEGAN REES: Oh, I'm sorry.
Can we -- can we bring those eggs back? I will get you a successor.
MS. HAJJAR: No, but it would make a huge difference if things went much faster.
MAEGAN REES: I want the life with you.
MS. HAJJAR: I don't know if I have the will to build another.
MAEGAN REES: I will help you this time.
MS. HAJJAR: Have to start soon.
MAEGAN REES: Yes, I'll find one and help you.
MS. HAJJAR: There are the young ones, but there's quite a time before they can even start.
MAEGAN REES: I'll get you more options.
MS. HAJJAR: How many attractive, not socially defective virgins would give their life to someone like me at my age?
MAEGAN REES: Ummm, all of them? You are handsome, sexy, strong, gentle, loving, funny, talented, have a beautiful smile, eyes, loving touch. What woman wouldn't want that? You know for a fact that they all want you.
MS. HAJJAR: Even an inexperienced 18-year-old?
MAEGAN REES: Even an inexperienced 15-year-old.
MS. HAJJAR: Would need to be a once in a lifetime person, and I had that and lost it.
Can you read the next two messages, Agent Rees?
MAEGAN REES: Emoticon. I am sorry.
MS. HAJJAR: When I finally -- had finally found you, that was it for me.
MAEGAN REES: I am so stupid. I am so sorry.
MS. HAJJAR: This is page 680 from Government Exhibit 310-R.
Can you read the top of the highlighted portion, please?
MAEGAN REES: December 27th, 2015, 5:52 p.m.: I imagine that you are doing all sorts of sexual stuff on a beautiful tropical setting. I have nothing to base this on, that's why I said crazy.
MS. HAJJAR: Although that shouldn't matter, it absolutely not so?
MAEGAN REES: I feel ashamed for feeling this way because I want to accept you, and I do, lovingly, no matter if you are having crazy sex with sexy bitches. Oh, you beat me to it. I want to accept you fully no matter what, but I just with and to share with you my crazy self.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. News?
MAEGAN REES: I love you. I want to know about you, your adventures, what your eyes are seeing, what you're feeling. I miss you. I miss you so much.
MS. HAJJAR: Nothing yet. I've been dealing with difficult things and people. It is the 28th here. I'm so sad about us. I'm saddened you don't text as I would like and haven't told me more about the transcript, et cetera.
MAEGAN REES: I thought it might be the day there already. It is not here yet. I lurk.
MS. HAJJAR: I haven't experienced that program you spoke of to give me peace of mind.
MAEGAN REES: But I am sorry I don't text as much.
MS. HAJJAR: Why not?
MAEGAN REES: I tell you about everything I do. Whenever you don't hear from me, I am doing the last thing I told you about still. Like right now, I'm still with RJ since I told you about it last night.
MS. HAJJAR: That's what you said in the past.
MAEGAN REES: I have only ran, that's the only exciting thing I have done. I have been struggling with my emotions. It is very hard not talking to you. I am having a very rough time. I did not expect this when I thought of the program. I am having a rough time emotionally. I cry every day several times a day. I feel depressed. The only concern I can see that would be legitimate would be that I am going crazy and that I am not emotionally sound.
MS. HAJJAR: This is page 683 of the same exhibit, December 28th, 2015, 1:17 a.m.
Keith Raniere: Make another successor. Give me you in ways you would never have.
MAEGAN REES: I thought that was because I didn't want him, that I was under his spell or trance. It could have been reversed. I didn't want him. I would never want him because he is not you. I thought that would make a difference.
MS. HAJJAR: His DNA touched you and went inside you and was assimilated. Also, he has memories of your interactions and you have memories. All of those things need to be eliminated. If that could be, then maybe I would have the connection that was lost the very first time.
MAEGAN REES: How do I do that? I'll do anything. I'll eat shit. I'll do anything.
MS. HAJJAR: I have told you, if you find another successor that is best for us, but time is running short.
MAEGAN REES: Oh, I thought were you saying that maybe I would have the connection that was lost, the very first time.
MS. HAJJAR: Turning to page 688, December 28th, 2015, 8:54 p.m.
Keith Raniere: You joined Telegram and didn't tell me.
MAEGAN REES: I'm still trying to figure this phone out. I also have Facebook on my phone again, I think. Let me try you. I tried you on Telegram.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, this last message is in December '15. There are a few more messages in 2015, but the last page of Government Exhibit 310-R, page 689, have you reviewed messages that extend farther past this time period?
MAEGAN REES: I have not.
MS. HAJJAR: Do you know what Telegram is, what's mentioned here?
This is page 688 of Government Exhibit 310-R.
MAEGAN REES: I do.
MS. HAJJAR: What is it?
MAEGAN REES: It's a communications app with end-to-end encryption.
MS. HAJJAR: Maybe we can switch to the ELMO, Your Honor.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, have you also reviewed e-mails obtained by search warrant for the e-mail address camilascastle@yahoo.com?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: May I approach the witness, Your Honor?
THE COURT: Yes, you may.
MS. HAJJAR: I am going to show you what's been marked for identification as Government Exhibit 1400-4, 1400-6, 1400-23, 1400-25, 1400-30, 1400-45, 1400-65, 1400-99, 1400-134, 1400-151, 1400-197 and 1400-198.
MS. HAJJAR: May I approach the witness, Your Honor?
THE COURT: Yes, you may.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, can you take a look at these?
MAEGAN REES: (Witness complies.) Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, the exhibits you just reviewed, are these e-mails that were obtained from Yahoo for the e-mail address camilascastle@yahoo.com?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, they were.
MS. HAJJAR: And have you reviewed each of these exhibits?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, I have.
MS. HAJJAR: Your Honor, the Government offers these exhibits.
MR. AGNIFILO: No objection, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Alright, Exhibits 1400-4, 1400-6, 1400-23, 1400-25, 1400-30, 1400-45, 1400-65 -- or is it 55?
MS. HAJJAR: Yes, Your Honor.
THE COURT: 65.
-- 1400-99, 1400-134, 1400-151, 1400-197, 1400-198 are received in evidence.
(Government's Exhibits 1400-4, 1400-6, 1400-23, 1400-25, 1400-30, 1400-45, 1400-65, 1400-99, 1400-134, 1400-151, 1400-197 and 1400-198 were received in evidence.)
MS. HAJJAR: Thank you, Your Honor.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, I am going to show you what's in evidence as Government's Exhibit 1400-4.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, can you read who this e-mail is from?
MAEGAN REES: Sorry, I have a black screen.
JUROR: They are all out.
THE COURT: I'm sorry?
MAEGAN REES: The screens went out.
THE COURT: Yes, I'll do it.
MAEGAN REES: I'm sorry, can you repeat the question?
MS. HAJJAR: Who is this e-mail from?
MAEGAN REES: Camila Rodriguez at camilascastle@yahoo.com.
MS. HAJJAR: And who is it to?
MAEGAN REES: Camilascastle@yahoo.com.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read the text of this e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Hey, I went to cut my hair, but apparently I need your permission. I wouldn't do it right away since I can't afford it, but I'd like to know so I can start making plans. Let me know.
MS. HAJJAR: Now, I want to show you what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 1400-6.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: And the bottom e-mail, who is that e-mail from?
MAEGAN REES: From camilascastle@yahoo.com.
MS. HAJJAR: And to who?
MAEGAN REES: Camilascastle@yahoo.com.
MS. HAJJAR: And what was the date it was sent?
MAEGAN REES: Monday, February 23rd, 2009.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read the text of this e-mail, please?
MAEGAN REES: Am I a liability to you? I sometimes get that impression from the way you treat me. And I hadn't really thought about it until now, which makes me think, there's not much I can do if you don't tell me. I guess I keep hoping that our relationship will be like a fairytale. So far, the facts have proven me wrong, except for our love, which is the best kind of love that I've ever experienced. Although it seems to be that not even love is enough for us to be together.
I imagine that there are many other women that could say the same things that I'm saying. I'd like to know something from you. Does our relationship have potential to be unique and special? You know what I mean? Please. This is important to me. Me.
P.S. Not only have we not had sex this year, we have not had sex in three months. Yay, my lover won't touch me, I feel so wanted. Not funny, right?
MS. HAJJAR: What about the above e-mail, who is it from?
MAEGAN REES: It's from camilascastle@yahoo.com.
MS. HAJJAR: And who is it to? Is it the same e-mail address that is the recipient?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And what's the date?
MAEGAN REES: Tuesday, February 24th, 2009.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read the text of this e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Before you cut the hair, lose the weight and I'll make it worth your while. I'm sorry about the other stuff. I will tell you about the potential of us face-to-face. I will also talk to you about the liability thing. As for the other, hmmm, yum, XXXXX.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, have you reviewed the camilascastle@yahoo.com e-mail account, many e-mails from that account?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: And is it common in that account to have e-mails which appear to be sent to and from the same e-mail account?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it does.
MS. HAJJAR: Do they appear to be addressing each other, the e-mails that are sent in succession?
MAEGAN REES: They do.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. And the signatures associated with some of the e-mails that are sent, is it -- are they signed VC or Camila?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: And the other responses that are responded to, does it appear to be some other user, other than Camila?
MAEGAN REES: It does.
MS. HAJJAR: And what is the date -- we've been -- for most of your testimony today, Agent Rees, you've been talking about communications from 2015 or thereabouts.
What's the date of these communications?
MAEGAN REES: 2009.
MS. HAJJAR: And I am going to show you what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 1400-23.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: The bottom e-mail, again, is this camilascastle@yahoo.com to camilascastle@yahoo.com?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it is.
MS. HAJJAR: What's the sent date?
MAEGAN REES: Wednesday, March 4th, 2009.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read the text of this e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Hello, my sweet lollipop. I really enjoyed your form tonight. You never cease to amaze me. It seems as if the more I love you, the more I admire you and am curious to get to know you. I like what I see in you. You have a brilliant mind and I think you know it, yet you possess a certain humility that I think everyone should aspire to. I admire what you do in the world and the strength that you do it with. I think you are an inspiration to everyone. I admire you as a character and deeply love you as my lollipop.
Smiley face. Kisses, hugs and sniffles. VC.
MS. HAJJAR: And is there a response to this e-mail on the same day?
MAEGAN REES: They're --
MS. HAJJAR: Camilascastle@yahoo.com to camilascastle@yahoo.com?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: And does the text of that e-mail -- it's: Re fan mail winky face. The text of the e-mail is: Lollipops love to be licked by very obedient slaves.
MAEGAN REES: Correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And, again, this is in 2009?
MAEGAN REES: Correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Showing you what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 1400-25. The bottom e-mail.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: Again, is this camilascastle@yahoo.com to camilascastle@yahoo.com on March 5th, 2009?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read the text of this -- the text of this e-mail, please?
MAEGAN REES: I was sad to find out that you were screening my calls. I thought we were better than that. Lollipop, it is your loss. You are missing out on all the fun. I am losing weight and looking better every day, but you wouldn't know because you don't even pick up the phone for me. Raspberry. Whatev. Anyway, I had some pretty cool stuff to tell you, but I guess you'll never find out. Wa-ha-ha, wa-ha-ha-ha, that's my evil laugh by the way. Be well.
MS. HAJJAR: And is there a responsive e-mail the following day from camilascastle@yahoo.com to camilascastle@yahoo.com?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read the responsive e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Honey, I do not screen your calls unless, one, I am on an expensive conference call; two, other people are right there in a very problematic way. Please, please, please understand.
Besides, you have to tell me your pretty cool stuff anyway if you are a good slave. The great day thing should probably be changed. If you sign your e-mail with a XO, then there is a message.
I've been thinking about some very creative torturous -- well, I guess you will just have to be a good girl and find out.
MS. HAJJAR: Showing you what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 1400-30. At the bottom camilascastle@yahoo.com.
Can you read the text of that e-mail?
(Exhibit published.)
MAEGAN REES: Hee, hee, hee, today I found out that people think I'm still a virgin. Wa-ha-ha, wa-ha-ha.
MS. HAJJAR: And is there a responsive e-mail the next day, March 8th, 2009, again the same e-mail account being used to send and receive the e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: Yum, I have so much experience for you?
MAEGAN REES: Correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Now I am showing you what's in evidence as Government's Exhibit 1400-45.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: So does this appear to be an e-mail with various forwards?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it does.
MS. HAJJAR: What's the -- what's the e-mail at the bottom?
MAEGAN REES: The first e-mail is an e-mail from KeithRaniere@yahoo.com to Marianna, themightyrunner@gmail.com.
MS. HAJJAR: And is there a URL at the bottom?
MAEGAN REES: There is.
MS. HAJJAR: Sleepy dog is the subject of the e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you describe -- this appears to be a forward in the second e-mail.
Can you describe from who it is and to whom and when?
MAEGAN REES: It appears the original e-mail was then forwarded from Marianna, themightyrunner@gmail.com to Daniela, thegreathead@gmail.com; Camila@yahoo.com, Adrianflofito@gmail.com; Adriana, theinnerwitch@gmail.com, Hector, Hector@gmail.com.
MS. HAJJAR: What is the date that that e-mail was sent?
MAEGAN REES: March 18th, 2009.
MS. HAJJAR: And then is there a third forward e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: Who sent it and to whom?
MAEGAN REES: It was a forwarded e-mail from Camila@yahoo.com to camilascastle@yahoo.com.
MS. HAJJAR: And what date?
MAEGAN REES: March 19th, 2009.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read the text of this e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Seriously? It would take her nothing to erase the text that says that this is originally from you. I question her intention, especially because it pisses me off. Ha-ha. I'm getting really unhappy about this. What are you not telling me? You are going beyond keeping her happy. Are you lying to me?
MS. HAJJAR: I am showing you what's in evidence as Government's Exhibit 1400-65.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Now, the bottom e-mail, it's an e-mail from camilascastle@yahoo.com to camilascastle@yahoo.com on June 20th, 2009?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read the text of this e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Hi, love. I just wanted to drop by to tell you that you have my full support in whatever you are doing. I say whatever because you don't always tell me what it is that you do for people, and I just have a feeling that it is a lot.
I'm very grateful for everything you've done for me. I want to return the favor by taking the burden that you carry, but most of the time I end up feeling incompetent and end up not helping at all. You deserve the best and I will try to give you just that.
I feel like I should keep you informed with what's going on in VC land. There are days that I'm feeling very lovey, gooey; and then there are days when I just feel like picking a fight or having something to complain about for no good reason. I think that part is clear most of the time. I am trying to figure out what to do with this. I know that you are not up for this. My mental notes don't help me get out of this state. They just remind me that it is not about you. So I need to do some thinking and figuring out, but I just wanted to bring you up to speed.
Want to get in a fight with me? I'm totally fine with you winning and I promise I won't complain if you end up pinning me to the floor or the wall; hee-hee. I think I'm going to try to save these feelings, cravings -- yes, they are the same thing -- for some other occasion, if you know what I mean, wink face. Or maybe I just need a good spanking, I don't know. What you think, Master? What does this good old VC mean? Okay, I'm getting way too into it. Let's move on.
I want to help you get healthy again. Today, and always, on the VC menu we offer walks, healthy juice, delicious pussy, lovely conversations full of XXX topics. I strongly suggest the pussy. It is light on the beaver and fresh out of jailbait grounds. Hopefully, you will have something nice to think about for the next hours and maybe days. Enjoy. Love, Slavey Slave.
MS. HAJJAR: This e-mail was sent on June 20th, 2009. Is there a responsive e-mail on the same day?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, that's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: What does the responsive e-mail say?
MAEGAN REES: Yum. Thank you. I love you and your... against... the pinned to the...
MS. HAJJAR: I am showing you what's in evidence as Government Exhibit 1400-99.
(Exhibit published.)
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Just again, this is an e-mail signed C, March 20th, 2010. If you could just read the first few paragraphs of this bottom e-mail, please.
MAEGAN REES: Hey, hon, I've been thinking about us a lot. I prefer to talk to you in person, but I have no idea when you are going to call next and how long you are going to be able to stay on the phone.
I've grown a little concerned about us. Your inconsistency would be alright, but now it is making me uncertain of all the things you've told me, and only me. See, the other day I watched a movie where a woman was accused of harassing a man that she claimed to be her lover. All the proof that she had could not be confirmed because everything she had was from conversations they'd had. I am afraid that one day I'll find out that I am this woman. I have nothing to show for this relationship, no proof, except what you have told me.
But now I feel it would be irresponsible to not see the reality. What I see as undeniable is the fact that you don't maintain communication. Sometimes we go about a month without seeing each other, and you don't mind. You don't show for the days that I consider to, show for that, I consider to count and other things that probably already know of. I want to re-evaluate this relationship. I am starting to feel like it is not healthy. Everything is on your terms. This doesn't feel like a partnership anymore. I don't feel like I have a lot to say, and I'd like for it to be a partnership, a strong team.
Prove me wrong or just tell me for sure that I am right. At least things would make sense.
(Continued on the following page.)
(Continuing)
MS. HAJJAR: And is there a responsive e-mail at the top?
You're very incorrect and sad face?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: All right. I'm showing you what's in evidence as Government's Exhibit 1400-134.
(Exhibit published to jury.)
MS. HAJJAR: Again, the bottom e-mail CamilasCastle@yahoo.com to CamilasCastle@yahoo.com.
Can you read the text of this e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: I am hoping for a little more communication, if possible. It bothers me that you treat other acquaintances better or more personally than me. Just a thought.
MS. HAJJAR: And is there a responsive e-mail on the next day? This is August 29th, 2010?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there is.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read that e-mail back, please?
MAEGAN REES: I am under surveillance and parabolic microphone pick up everything whispered to me. Can you get a walkie-talkie and use extension 96. Opposite of? I will likely have some time today. Love.
MS. HAJJAR: Showing you what's in evidence as Government's Exhibit 1400-151.
MS. HAJJAR: Starting from the bottom, is this an e-mail from CamilasCastle@yahoo.com to CamilasCastle@yahoo.com on December 19th, 2010 with the text: How come you never write me?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it is.
MS. HAJJAR: And what is the responsive e-mail on November 18th, 2010?
MAEGAN REES: Just checking to see if my sunshine wrote. I know you're locked up. Only wish I were the one doing the restraining. With rope. Or whatever. Yum.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. Is there another e-mail back the same day?
Oh, I didn't know I was your sunshine as well?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And the last e-mail, again, the same account.
Can you read the text?
MAEGAN REES: Hi honey, today is likely to be a very difficult day for it appears there are increased efforts to destroy my image, et cetera. I was just thinking of you as an oasis. Love and gadgets.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay.
MS. HAJJAR: And then showing you what's in evidence as Government's Exhibit 1400-197.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: The bottom e-mail, March 1st, 2011, 2:31 a.m. Can you read the text of this e-mail?
MAEGAN REES: Hey. Sorry that there are so many new messages in the inbox. I just can't seem to be able to reach you. I am feeling a little desperate and frustrated. Time seems to go by and I just feel very stuck here. I want to be able to move around. Oh, and speaking of stuff, it has become really hard for me to lose weight. I ran eight miles the other day and I didn't seem to lose much. I am becoming really frustrated and anxious because I know you want me to lose weight and be super-thin. Especially for this thing coming up. Ah. I'm sorry, I'm just feeling very hungry, fat and like a failure. I am so hungry. I feel like I want to throw in the towel and eat whatever I want. I wish you would call. I've been trying to call you to invite you on a walk. I figured it would be pretty safe in the middle of the night and I get to burn some calories, but I just can't seem to reach you.
MS. HAJJAR: And then the responsive e-mail, can you read the text of that. On April 16th, 2011.
MAEGAN REES: Thinking of you. Open attachment when you are alone.
MS. HAJJAR: Your Honor, can I show something to the witness for identification only.
THE COURT: Sure.
MR. AGNIFILO: Can we have a quick side-bar, Judge?
THE COURT: Sure.
(Side-bar conference held on the record out of the hearing of the jury.)
(Continued on following page.)
(Side-bar.)
THE COURT: Okay.
MR. AGNIFILO: So, the objection is, I think where the prosecutor's going to go, she's going to give an image to the witnesses that -- a highly pornographic image. And my understanding is she is not going to put the image into evidence, but she's going to have her describe it. And I think I object. I don't know -- I can show Your Honor what the image is and the description of it I assume would be, you know, fairly graphic.
And so, I just object to this portion of the testimony.
THE COURT: All right.
Is that what you are going to do?
MS. HAJJAR: It is very graphic, Your Honor. It's being sent to a 19-year-old girl by the defendant and I think it's important to elicit what is being sent to her. I will have the witness describe it rather than show the image to the jury, but it is significant.
MR. AGNIFILO: I can show the Court.
THE COURT: Is there an Exhibit Number?
MS. HAJJAR: It's 198, Your Honor.
THE COURT: Who has got the image?
MR. AGNIFILO: I have it.
(Pause in the proceedings.)
MR. AGNIFILO: I just think there's been a lot of very graphic, sexual testimony. I don't know that this advances the ball.
THE COURT: Well, that is pretty extreme.
MR. AGNIFILO: Yes, I think so.
THE COURT: No, no, no, no. I look at it a little differently. It is a little extreme and the question is, what is the evidentiary value as opposed to the possible harm that it will do? Let's just talk about this in strictly medicinal terms.
MS. HAJJAR: What's significant, Your Honor, is that -- there are two things. One is the relationship when it begins; that so early on, this relationship is highly sexualized. But what's significant about this image is that it's a BDSM like, slave-master-type image. So early. That happened, that we just, as opposed to the rest of the day discussing text messages and messages that talk about these types of things in 2015, but the fact that this was the nature of the tenor of this highly-sexualized relationship that has a BDSM component so early on is significant.
MR. AGNIFILO: I mean, I think we can't lose sight of the fact the defendant is not charged with any of this.
THE COURT: What about that?
MS. HAJJAR: He is, Your Honor. What ends up happening with Camila is that she, as Lauren Salzman's testified, when Nicole testified --
THE COURT: Hold on.
(In open court.)
THE COURT: Could I ask everyone to please -- excuse me. Could I ask everyone to please take conversation out of the courtroom. We have the jury in the box and I would not want to jury to overhear anything that would be inappropriate.
Thank you.
(Side-bar continues.)
MS. HAJJAR: Your Honor, later this week Nicole will testify that she was tied up, tied to a table and someone she didn't know performed oral sex on her. Lauren Salzman testified that the person who performed that oral sex was, in fact, Camila. The fact that nearly ten years prior to that this is the image and that's being sent to Camila by the defendant is significant, Your Honor. I think it has a significant probative value.
THE COURT: All right. Well, let me see how far you get. At some point, I may stop you. But some discussion of this is appropriate and I do not think there is a 403 problem.
In this case there is so much going on that it is hard to identify where something becomes far more prejudicial than it is probative. But some of the discussion is so extreme that I am not sure where we have that dividing line.
You are not going to show the picture and be careful what questions you ask.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay, Your Honor.
THE COURT: The objection is overruled.
MR. AGNIFILO: Thank you.
(Side-bar end.)
(Continued on following page.)
(In open court.)
THE COURT: Okay. Thank you everybody.
You may continue your examination.
BY MS. HAJJAR:
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, I'm going to show you, just to you, an image that's accompanied -- did this image accompany the e-mail that is we were just reading?
THE COURT: This is Exhibit Number?
MS. HAJJAR: It's marked as 1400-198.
Do you see it?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, I do.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you describe to the jury generally what this image is of?
MAEGAN REES: This is an image of a BDSM act in which a woman is bound by her hands and legs as well as a hook. It appears to be a ceiling in giving -- performing oral sex to a male.
MS. HAJJAR: I'd like to show you what's been marked for identification only as 1400-202.
MS. HAJJAR: Is this a responsive e-mail to the e-mail you just referred to, Agent Rees?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it is.
MS. HAJJAR: Your Honor, the Government offers Government's Exhibit 1400-202 into evidence.
MR. AGNIFILO: One second, Your Honor?
THE COURT: Sure.
(Pause in the proceedings.)
MR. AGNIFILO: We do object, Your Honor. On some of the grounds that we discussed.
THE COURT: Yes, I heard. Grounds at side-bar?
MR. AGNIFILO: No, more that we talked about this morning.
THE COURT: I see. Okay.
(Pause in the proceedings.)
THE COURT: Overruled.
MS. HAJJAR: Your Honor, may I publish this Exhibit?
THE COURT: Yes, you may.
(Government's Exhibit 1400-202 received in evidence.)
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: At the bottom, Agent Rees, the e-mail from CamilasCastle@yahoo.com to CamilasCastle@yahoo.com. Is this the responsive e-mail to the e-mail that held the attachment you just described?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it is.
MS. HAJJAR: Is part of the text the e-mail says: Oh, my God, ha ha ha, crafty I must say but it looks a little uncomfortable?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And last e-mail Agent Rees, I would like to show the witness for identification.
THE COURT: Go ahead.
MS. HAJJAR: Exhibit 1400-62.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, is this another CamilasCastle@yahoo.com to CamilasCastle@yahoo.com e-mail chain?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it is.
MS. HAJJAR: The Government offers 1400-62, Your Honor.
MR. AGNIFILO: One second, Judge.
(Pause in the proceedings.)
MR. AGNIFILO: We do object.
THE COURT: Can I see what is at the bottom.
Overruled.
(Government's Exhibit 1400-62 received in evidence.)
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: Thank you, Your Honor.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, starting at the bottom this is another chain of E-mail the from CamilasCastle@yahoo.com?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it is.
MS. HAJJAR: The bottom e-mail, that subject line: Couple thoughts for you.
Is that dated June 13th, 2009?
MAEGAN REES: It is.
MS. HAJJAR: And has the first three words: Hi sweet lollipop?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it does.
MS. HAJJAR: And then, next e-mail. The responsive e-mail, June 13th, 2009, is that another CamilasCastle@yahoo.com to CamilasCastle@yahoo.com?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, it is.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read the text of this e-mail, please?
MAEGAN REES: Yes. I can't wait to do all the things I've planned. Hmm, the three-way thing I would do with you. I think I would have to be there. Read your sentence on this. It sounds as though you might do it without me. I suspect this is not what you meant. Keep me informed. We will figure it out on a step-by-step basis. Until, of course, I tie you up and force your pussy to be licked.
MS. HAJJAR: Then the last e-mail on the top. Another responsive e-mail on June 15th, 2009?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And that's 1:04 a.m.?
MAEGAN REES: Correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you read the last paragraph, please.
MAEGAN REES: Well, with that said, I am happy to announce that today was the beginning of a new three-month cycle of pills. Smiley face. Which means if you so choose to accept your challenge, lots and lots of practice. There are some things that I want to learn and explore. By the way, I am very curious as to what you say you want to do to me. How exactly do you see me? Am I not virgin Camila? Yours Truly, Cami.
MS. HAJJAR: Agent Rees, I want to switch back or direct your attention to vicibaby@gmail.com and a photograph that you testified they were photographs associated with the account that were provided by Google?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: The photographs have accompanying metadata for them?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay.
MS. HAJJAR: And so, I'm showing you what's in evidence as Government's Exhibit 1160.
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: At the top. What is does this appear to be?
MAEGAN REES: A screen shot of a WhatsApp conversation.
MS. HAJJAR: And what's the name at the top of the screen shot?
MAEGAN REES: Unknown caller.
MS. HAJJAR: And can you read the texts that appear under unknown caller.
MAEGAN REES: I am crying again.
Are you almost home.
It's going to be almost 24 hours since I heard from you.
I miss you.
Can you Skype from the airport.
Our last chance.
Hi my sweetheart.
Are you almost home.
In LA, no texts.
Shit, I still don't have a signal.
Taking off for New York, Monkey is stuck.
Landed in New York.
MS. HAJJAR: Now, are the texts in green and the texts in white different users?
MAEGAN REES: Yes.
MS. HAJJAR: Can you tell which is which?
MAEGAN REES: By the color of the text message box.
MS. HAJJAR: And so the top messages in green are one user and the bottom are mother?
MAEGAN REES: That's correct.
MS. HAJJAR: And then the metadata associated with this image?
(Exhibit published.)
MS. HAJJAR: Can you just read the creation date and time?
MAEGAN REES: January 5th, 2016 at 20:14 PST.
MS. HAJJAR: Okay. All right, Agent Rees, is there a pregnancy test photograph that you also reviewed in the Vicibaby account?
MAEGAN REES: Yes, there was.
MS. HAJJAR: Does it reflect a positive pregnancy test?
MAEGAN REES: It did.
MS. HAJJAR: Was there accompanying metadata for that as well?
MAEGAN REES: There was.
MS. HAJJAR: I'm showing what's in evidence as Government's Exhibit 1164.
(Pause in the proceedings.)
MS. HAJJAR: I believe it's in evidence, Your Honor.
THE COURT: I'm sorry, why isn't it up?
You know, it's 5:00 o'clock. We can suspend for the night and work on this overnight.
MS. HAJJAR: That's fine, Your Honor, thank you.
THE COURT: All right?
All right, Members of the Jury, this is to remind you again that it is very important that you not discuss this case with anyone; not your family, friends, business associates and not your fellow jurors.
In addition, do not read, listen to, watch or access any accounts of this case on any form of media such as newspapers, TV, radio, podcasts or the internet, nor research or seek outside information about any aspect of the case, and do not communicate with anyone about the case on your phone, whether through e-mail, text messaging or anything other means, through any blog or website or by way of any social media including Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, YouTube or other similar sites.
Please do not consider anything you have read or heard about this case outside this courtroom, whether you read it before or during the jury selection or at this trial. And do not visit any of the locations mentioned during the course of jury selection or trial.
See you tomorrow morning at 9:30, thank you very much for your attention.
All rise for the jury.
COURT CLERK: All rise.
(Jury exits.)
(In open court; outside the presence of the jury.)
THE COURT: All right. The witness may stand down. Do not discuss your testimony with anyone.
MAEGAN REES: Thank you.
THE COURT: See you tomorrow morning at 9:30.
(Witness excused.)
THE COURT: Please be seated, everyone.
About how much more do you have?
MS. HAJJAR: Ten to fifteen minutes, Your Honor.
THE COURT: All right.
About how much on cross?
MR. AGNIFILO: Ten, fifteen minutes tops.
THE COURT: Then the next witness is who?
MR. LESKO: Dr. Dawn Hughes.
THE COURT: And Dr. Hughes will be on the record for about how long?
MR. LESKO: I think direct will be maybe a little more than an hour.
THE COURT: All right.
Do you have a sense of the cross?
MR. AGNIFILO: My colleague is going to cross Dr. Hughes.
MR. DEROHANNESIAN: Perhaps an hour to two.
THE COURT: Okay. That is fine.
After that, do we have another witness?
MS. PENZA: We have Nicole after that.
THE COURT: Nicole comes after that.
MS. PENZA: Yes.
THE COURT: Her direct will be about -- will that take us into Friday?
MS. PENZA: Yes, Your Honor.
Hopefully, be finished by the lunch break on Friday.
THE COURT: All right.
MR. AGNIFILO: The direct?
MS. PENZA: Yes.
THE COURT: Yes.
MR. AGNIFILO: So, I would think we could probably finish, if that's the case, on Friday with cross.
THE COURT: All right.
Next week we have all five days.
MR. AGNIFILO: Right.
THE COURT: Do you have a sense of the light at the end of tunnel here?
MS. PENZA: Yes, Your Honor.
The Government is hoping to rest either late next week or very early the week after.
THE COURT: All right. It is good to have that information.
You are going to have your proposed charge for the jury by this Friday?
MS. PENZA: Yes, Your Honor.
MR. AGNIFILO: Yes, Judge.
THE COURT: Okay.
All right, we will see you tomorrow morning, 9:30.
MR. AGNIFILO: Thank you.
THE COURT: Oh, before we adjourn, am I going to get a letter at 5:00 o'clock in the morning again?
MR. AGNIFILO: Only if I wake up at 3:00.
THE COURT: No, I am just worried that maybe -- you know, my problem is I would rather have us discuss whatever it is to discuss at 9:00 a.m. rather than at 9:30 because the jury is already here at 9:30, and I really do not want to keep them waiting, especially if I am asking them to stay until 5:30.
MR. AGNIFILO: No, I cannot think of any issue.
MS. PENZA: Well, Your Honor, we've raised a couple issues with Defense Counsel and we would like to write on them if there is going to be an issue, so.
THE COURT: Oh, this is your turn? For a 5:00 a.m. letter?
MS. PENZA: Well, we are hoping to avoid a 5:00 a.m. letter.
THE COURT: Well, try to avoid it.
MR. AGNIFILO: There are three things I think that the Government's concerned about, one of which I agree with them. The other two, I have to think about. I might not agree with them on the other two.
THE COURT: I see.
All right. Well, try to work it out. I will see you tomorrow morning at 9:30.
Thank you very much, have a good evening.
(Matter adjourned to Wednesday, June 6th, 2019 at 9:30 a.m.)
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